Home Forums Discussions Problems looking for a server

hi guys and thank you ahead of time
we are currently using a dell server with 2003 server addition. it is so slow with AC. my boss is ready to upgrade so i want to take advantage of that. my budget however is about $2000. if you have suggestion as to what i should get please help. we currently have 3 dell pc's and two laptops running off the server. even the AC techies have commented on how slow our server. all suggestion are apreciated

dale edwards

I don't want to deter you from the joys (?!) of setting up a new server on your network, but have you tried the obvious? Max out the server's RAM (cost about $30-50/GB)& install a Gigabit ethernet card on the server and as many of the clients that can be upgraded (cost about $40/adapter).

I second John, esp. as any money you spend on client machine memory will still be of benefit with a new server.

In a recent Post Bert walked through how to run speed test on the server and client machines to establish a *before* baseline.

After that , since you are a Dell shop already, I'd look at their lower end server configs 310 or 410. Bert has also posted about the 410 server and configs. If you go the Dell route, and want to talk to the Dell rep that I use for clients, just send me a Private Message (PM).

To save money on the software side, you might want to look at going with the MicroSoft Foundation Server, it will save you on software licensing, and still gives you a server OS.

Here is a thread I started on the foundation server:

http://www.amazingcharts.com/ub/ubb...Re_From_P2P_to_Client_Server_f#Post20094

I agree with both John and Indy. I do think we could help more if we had a lot more information. In fact, John's ideas are great, but they may be moot if you already have them. Here is a start:

1. What model and what specs is the server? A 2900 PE with 4GB of RAM and a RAID1 is a lot faster than a startup model with 1GB. If you only have 1GB, SQL will take up to 1GB, and it won't be long until it loads up the RAM with pages and procedures.
2. What exact OS is it?
3. Again, processor speed, RAM, hard drives, NIC card, etc.
4. Clients. What are the three desktops? Again, what are the specs. RAM will matter and processor will help. But, RAM is always good. As John alluded to, what speed are the Ethernet (NIC) cards. After we know, we will want to know what the duplex is. A 1GB card set at 10-half is only as good as 10-half.
5. Are you using Cat5 or Cat5e or Cat6?
6. KEY. ARE YOU USING A SWITCH OR A HUB? What is the speed of the switch?
7. After going to Amazing Utilities, go to Advanced at the top and check speeds. These should be in the 0.6 to 1.5 range. Anything higher, I would worry.
8. No one does this, but I will try it anyway. Troubleshoot through isolation. If one is slow, disconnect ALL computers from the network. Run AC on the server. How fast is it?
9. Add a computer to the switch. Look at all the things we talked about. RAM, processor, NIC and see how fast it runs.
10. If good speed, add another, and so on. If you find one that is really slow, go back and check the others. If you are using a hub run to the nearest computer store and buying a switch. With a hub, every computer you add will slow down your network. Switches are smart, hubs are dumb.
11. On your server, open task manager and click on Processes. On the right, click on Mem Usage, until the process with the highest memory utilization is at the top. It WILL be SQL. How much is it?
12. Click on performance tab. At bottom under Physical Memory (K), how much Total Memory and how much Available memory do you have? The total memory should reflect how much RAM you have in your PC. The available is the total minus what your computer is using. If there is very little available, that's a problem. That is where adding RAM will give you a lot of help.
13. Reboot the server. Check these numbers again. SQL should give back its memory to the server again.
14. If RAM is an issue, right click on My Computer, choose Advanced. Under virtual memory, choose Change. Choose custom size and enter the same number in Initial MB and Maximum MB. These numbers should be 1.5 times your RAM on the server. This could be very helpful if you have too little RAM.

Using the $2,000 to upgrade your system or go with Foundation Server will be helpful. Otherwise, trying to buy a decent server with good specs and an OS and licenses will cost your boss more than that.

But, just a plain Dell Optiplex computer with 2GB of RAM and a Pentium Dual Core processor of the speeds today, should run AC just fine.

Unfortunately, in any system, there are bottlenecks. Somewhat you have one.

Any idea how to speed up wireless? Amazing utilities on server shows speed about .5, on wired about one sec, but wireless about 3 sec. Just added Gigabit switch for whole network (did wonders for many things including FAX) tried different channels of N. Its not a big deal,but would love faster if easy .

There really isn't going to be an easy way. This is the downside of wireless. If you are using 802.11n, then you can expect maximum speeds of just over 100Mbs, but there is a lot of overhead there, but it is much better than before. But, there is no wireless that can take full advantage of a Gigabit switch.

As you see, bottlenecks can be everywhere. Given that all computers must go through the switch, upgrading was a great idea. Cat5e and Cat6 can both run at 1Gb. It would seem at some point, wireless would become faster, but wired continues to stay far ahead.

There is only so much speed you can get. I mean if your Internet connection were 1Gbs down, you an incredible difference. But, on a network, whether you have 1Gbs or 100Gbs (which isn't possible -- just making a point), your packets can only travel so fast.

I think 3 seconds to 1 second is rather good. The best way to speed up your network would be to go all wired.

If you could give us the standard you are using (I am guessing what I stated above) and what wireless router, distances, WAPs, etc.

Just wondering. Is there a notable difference. I mean if can have two computers relatively close together, does AC open and work about three times faster?

Cisco small business wrv4400N router. WPA. 54mbps indicated speed on Fujitsu tablet. 3 sec range on amazing utilities thru office suite...one meter from router same as sixty meters from router. Wireless not three times slower,but noticeable.

Well, if you have a GB switch with all GB NICs and are running Cat5e or Cat6, then your wired, in theory, is always going to be noticeably faster than wireless. So, all in all, I think you are doing OK.

Are you sure this isn't the WRVS4400N and not just WRV...?

Hi Dale!

These are our suggestions so far. Any of them help? It's rewarding to know if any of our comments helped. And, more importantly, a lot of users can benefit from it including us.

Thanks.

WRVS4400N is correct, sorry. Bert you are very detail oriented.

Well, we don't want to leave the poor "S" out. It is a very neglected letter.

I guess I should be a doctor. <GRIN>

Dale,

There have been no further comments from you in nine days. Should I assume that you have found your answer or are getting the help you need in a PM?

If so, is it OK if I go ahead and close the question.

Thanks.

I am liking this thread. Bert: how often do you fuss with your server? At first I logged on a lot, updating windows etc. Lately I have been lazy and have not logged in in weeks. Overall AC running well. Should I do anything on server routinely to increase safety or decrease chance of crash? I have good backups of AC data in place and out of office.

When you say you like it, you mean you don't want it closed?

Dont close yet.

First question first.

You are right. I mess with my server way too much. You are probably much better off. First do no harm remember. But, I like to tinker and that means playing with it a bit.

A few things come to mind:

1. definitely updates
2. make sure backups are working
3. not sure which server you have. Microsoft has free tools called Best Practices Analyzer.
4. check error messages, but don't freak out over each one.
5.Also call your computer company, Dell, HP or look up in manual. They have free software to monitor your server

mkweiss,

As far as closing this thread, one of the abilities and responsibilites of being a "global mod" is being able to format and move posts. Like when I hijacked Indy's thread on Droid, I moved my posts and unhijacked it.

Here it wouldn't be that helpful. In other forums, the entire thread is based on the author's question. I was kind of talking about closing the question based on other forum's rules. A little tongue-in-cheek, but a bit serious.

Question was asked and, on the SAME day three users spent time trying to help. Since then, there has been no reply. One user offered to help offline and maybe that is where the question went. But, to be honest, I find it only common courtesy to post follow-up posts and work with those who have tried to help. Not so much for thanks (although that would be nice), but to give feedback and let those who are helping AND the entire community learn from the question. It is also very rewarding to know if you have helped or not.

This happens more than you think, and it is frustrating. I just think if you are going to ask the board a question, you should continue to participate in that question until it is either resolved or even not resolved.

Let me say that the vast majority of users do. We all learn, and I learn a ton both from reading other threads and from feedback on questions like these.

The author asked for help on sub par performance of his server.

I am just learning the etiquette, please excuse me if I am a bit awkward. I will try to behave.

No,no. This does not pertain to you. There is really nothing to learn. It's common sense. It's really not hard. If you ask a question, and one or more people try to help, you kind of owe it to them and the rest of the community to give feedback. That is pretty much the only etiquette. That and being nice to everyone. That is why there are emoticons. I will give the author credit that he started out by saying, Thanks in advance.

But, you are fine, really.

Here's what Dell just quoted me for a new server.


TOTAL QUOTE AMOUNT: $5,459.83
Product Subtotal: $5,197.59
Tax: $262.24
Shipping & Handling: $0.00
Shipping Method: Ground Total Number of System Groups: 1


GROUP: 1 QUANTITY: 1 SYSTEM PRICE: $4,895.00 GROUP TOTAL: $4,895.00

Base Unit: PowerEdge T310 Chassis with upto 4 Hot-Plug Hard Drives and LCD Diagnostics (224-6556)
Processor: Shipping for PowerEdge T310 (330-5947)
Memory: 6GB Memory (6x1GB), 800MHz Single Ranked RDIMM (317-2031)
Memory: Memory for 1CPU Platform (317-2022)
Video Card: X3460 Xeon Processor, 2.8 GHz 8M Cache, Turbo, HT (317-2043)
Video Card: PowerEdge T310 Heatsink (330-5114)
Hard Drive: HD Multi-Select (341-4158)
Hard Drive Controller: PERC 6/I Cable for Hot Plug Hard Drive (330-5399)
Hard Drive Controller: PERC6i SAS RAID Controller Internal with Battery (341-6175)
Operating System: Microsoft Small Business Server 2008SP2, Standard Edition with Media (468-6502)
Operating System: $200 WINDOWS SMALL BUSINESS SERVER 2008 STANDARD MAIL IN REBATE REDEEM AT https://microsoft.young-america.com/ (468-9243)
NIC: On-Board Dual Gigabit Network Adapter (430-2008)
Modem: Baseboard Management Controller (313-7919)
TBU: Internal Storage Bay 5.25 RD1000 (341-9763)
TBU: Tape Backup SATA Cable for PET310 (330-6116)
CD-ROM or DVD-ROM Drive: SATA Optical Drive Cable for PowerEdge T310 (330-5342)
CD-ROM or DVD-ROM Drive: DVD+/-RW, SATA, INTERNAL (313-9097)
Documentation Diskette: Electronic System Documentation and OpenManage DVD Kit (330-5091)
Factory Installed Software: Symantec Backup Exec System Recovery 2010 SBS Edition 1yr (410-6122)
Feature RAID 5 - Add-in PERC6i/H700 (SAS/SATA Cntrlr), 3-4 Hot Plug Hard Drives (330-5104)
Service: Dell Hardware Limited Warranty Plus On Site Service Initial Year (904-8377)
Service: Dell Hardware Limited Warranty Extended Year (905-1428)
Service: Pro Support for End User: Next Business Day Onsite Service After Problem Diagnosis, 2Year Extended (904-1672)
Service: Pro Support for End User: Next Business Day Onsite Service After Problem Diagnosis, Initial Year (904-8880)
Service: ProSupport for End Users: 7x24 HW / SW Tech Support and Assistance for End Users, 3 Year (904-1742)
Service: Thank you choosing Dell ProSupport. For tech support, visit http://support.dell.com/ProSupport or call 1-800-9 (989-3439)
Installation: On-Site Installation Declined (900-9997)
Misc: Power Supply, Redundant, 400W (330-5111)
Misc: Power Cord, NEMA 5-15P to C13 (Y-cord), wall plug, 10 feet Quantity 2 (330-0579)
500GB 7.2K RPM SATA 3.5" Hot Plug Hard Drive (341-8728)
500GB 7.2K RPM SATA 3.5" Hot Plug Hard Drive (341-8728)
500GB 7.2K RPM SATA 3.5" Hot Plug Hard Drive (341-8728)
QTY 3, Internal Removable HardDisk for RD1000, 320GB Native/ 640GB Comp (341-7176)
QTY 3, Internal Removable HardDisk for RD1000, 320GB Native/ 640GB Comp (341-7176)
QTY 3, Internal Removable HardDisk for RD1000, 320GB Native/ 640GB Comp (341-7176)



SOFTWARE & ACCESSORIES

Product Quantity Unit Price Total
OLP WIN SMALL BUS CAL STE 2008 SNGL 5 NL USER CAL (A2108836) 1 $302.59 $302.59

Number of S & A Items: 1 S&A Total Amount: $302.59

I was a little taken back by the price. This was a re-bid after the first option with an Intel processor was 6500.00

This is obviously more than I have now. Dell server, 6 years old, 4GB ram, single hard drive. Currently my back up consists of a removable mirrored drive.

Here's what Dell just quoted me for a new server.


TOTAL QUOTE AMOUNT: $5,459.83
Product Subtotal: $5,197.59
Tax: $262.24
Shipping & Handling: $0.00
Shipping Method: Ground Total Number of System Groups: 1


GROUP: 1 QUANTITY: 1 SYSTEM PRICE: $4,895.00 GROUP TOTAL: $4,895.00

Base Unit: PowerEdge T310 Chassis with upto 4 Hot-Plug Hard Drives and LCD Diagnostics (224-6556)
Processor: Shipping for PowerEdge T310 (330-5947)
Memory: 6GB Memory (6x1GB), 800MHz Single Ranked RDIMM (317-2031)
Memory: Memory for 1CPU Platform (317-2022)
Video Card: X3460 Xeon Processor, 2.8 GHz 8M Cache, Turbo, HT (317-2043)
Video Card: PowerEdge T310 Heatsink (330-5114)
Hard Drive: HD Multi-Select (341-4158)
Hard Drive Controller: PERC 6/I Cable for Hot Plug Hard Drive (330-5399)
Hard Drive Controller: PERC6i SAS RAID Controller Internal with Battery (341-6175)
Operating System: Microsoft Small Business Server 2008SP2, Standard Edition with Media (468-6502)
Operating System: $200 WINDOWS SMALL BUSINESS SERVER 2008 STANDARD MAIL IN REBATE REDEEM AT https://microsoft.young-america.com/ (468-9243)
NIC: On-Board Dual Gigabit Network Adapter (430-2008)
Modem: Baseboard Management Controller (313-7919)
TBU: Internal Storage Bay 5.25 RD1000 (341-9763)
TBU: Tape Backup SATA Cable for PET310 (330-6116)
CD-ROM or DVD-ROM Drive: SATA Optical Drive Cable for PowerEdge T310 (330-5342)
CD-ROM or DVD-ROM Drive: DVD+/-RW, SATA, INTERNAL (313-9097)
Documentation Diskette: Electronic System Documentation and OpenManage DVD Kit (330-5091)
Factory Installed Software: Symantec Backup Exec System Recovery 2010 SBS Edition 1yr (410-6122)
Feature RAID 5 - Add-in PERC6i/H700 (SAS/SATA Cntrlr), 3-4 Hot Plug Hard Drives (330-5104)
Service: Dell Hardware Limited Warranty Plus On Site Service Initial Year (904-8377)
Service: Dell Hardware Limited Warranty Extended Year (905-1428)
Service: Pro Support for End User: Next Business Day Onsite Service After Problem Diagnosis, 2Year Extended (904-1672)
Service: Pro Support for End User: Next Business Day Onsite Service After Problem Diagnosis, Initial Year (904-8880)
Service: ProSupport for End Users: 7x24 HW / SW Tech Support and Assistance for End Users, 3 Year (904-1742)
Service: Thank you choosing Dell ProSupport. For tech support, visit http://support.dell.com/ProSupport or call 1-800-9 (989-3439)
Installation: On-Site Installation Declined (900-9997)
Misc: Power Supply, Redundant, 400W (330-5111)
Misc: Power Cord, NEMA 5-15P to C13 (Y-cord), wall plug, 10 feet Quantity 2 (330-0579)
500GB 7.2K RPM SATA 3.5" Hot Plug Hard Drive (341-8728)
500GB 7.2K RPM SATA 3.5" Hot Plug Hard Drive (341-8728)
500GB 7.2K RPM SATA 3.5" Hot Plug Hard Drive (341-8728)
QTY 3, Internal Removable HardDisk for RD1000, 320GB Native/ 640GB Comp (341-7176)
QTY 3, Internal Removable HardDisk for RD1000, 320GB Native/ 640GB Comp (341-7176)
QTY 3, Internal Removable HardDisk for RD1000, 320GB Native/ 640GB Comp (341-7176)



SOFTWARE & ACCESSORIES

Product Quantity Unit Price Total
OLP WIN SMALL BUS CAL STE 2008 SNGL 5 NL USER CAL (A2108836) 1 $302.59 $302.59

Number of S & A Items: 1 S&A Total Amount: $302.59

I was a little taken back by the price. This was a re-bid after the first option with an Intel processor was 6500.00

This is obviously more than I have now. Dell server, 6 years old, 4GB ram, single hard drive. Currently my back up consists of a removable mirrored drive.

Tom,

How many users/client stations?

What kind of growth do you expect/want to have over the next 2-3 years?

That kind of info will be helpful.

Here is another option for $1000.
Foundation server only, no tape hardware or software. Back up to external drive.

Greg
SYSTEM OPTIONS
PowerEdge T110
PowerEdge T110 Chassis with upto 4 Cabled Hard Drives edit
Processor
Intel® Xeon® X3430, 2.4 GHz, 8M Cache, Turbo edit
Memory
4GB Memory (4x1GB), 1333MHz, Single Ranked UDIMM edit
Operating System
Windows Server 2008 R2, Foundation Edition, x64 edit
OS Media kits
None edit
OS Client Access Licenses
None edit
OS Partitions
None edit
Hard Drive Configuration
RAID 1 - Add-in SAS6iR or H200 (SAS/SATA Controller), 2 Hard Drives edit
Primary Controller
SAS 6iR SAS internal RAID adapter, PCI-Express edit
Additional Controller
None edit
Hard Drives
160GB 7.2k RPM Serial ATA 3Gbps 3.5-in Cabled Hard Drive edit
Power Cords
Power Cord, NEMA 5-15P to C13, wall plug, 10 feet edit
SOFTWARE OPTIONS
Open Manage Subscription
None edit
Microsoft SQL Server
None edit
NETWORKING OPTIONS
Network Adapter
On-Board Single Gigabit Network Adapter edit
STORAGE BACKUP OPTIONS
Tape Backup
None edit
Tape Backup Software
None edit
Tape Media
None edit
Uninterruptible Power Supplies and Accessories
None edit
SYSTEMS MANAGEMENT
Embedded Management
Baseboard Management Controller edit
Systems Management Upgrades
None edit
OTHER OPTIONS
Internal Optical Drive
DVD Drive, Internal edit
Keyboards, Mice, Displays and Related Devices
None edit
System Documentation
Electronic System Documentation and OpenManage DVD Kit edit
Client Access Licenses
None edit
Server Accessories
None edit
OTHER OPTIONS
2nd Bay for Optical Drive
None edit
SERVICE OPTIONS
Hardware Support Services
1Yr Basic Hardware Warranty Repair: 5x10 HW-Only, 5x10 NBD Onsite edit

IMHO, that’s way too much server. I think I am reading a few things wrong, but here goes anyway:
I like the memory, although I would go 3x2GB
Do you mean Processor where you wrote Video Card?
Is the Dual Gb Network Adapter for two Ethernet ports? You only need one with 2008.
I would definitely not get Tape Backup. Tape is slowly, make that quickly dying and very expensive. I bet that doesn’t even count the cost of the 12 or more tapes.
Symantec Backup Exec. Do you really want to go there?
I guess I don’t understand the listing of the PERC6i/H700
How much are the Internal Removable HardDisks for backup? Can you not just get external USB hard drives for less money?

Thanks bert, That was a copy of the proposal pasted into the forum...it lost it's format in the process. I appreciate your thoughts, and I am in perfect agreement with your comments on symantec and the tape backup.

12 stations and plan on working towards patient entered data from the waiting room(Instant medical History)
The dual gigabyte network adapter is not necessary, but really cool! It does really reduce the work of the server CPU.

Yes, Bert, the list should read mother board, not video card. I don't have the itemized bid in front of to tell you the prices of the removable Hard drives.

Greg, I certainly like the price of your server. I was expecting a price point around 2,000. I'll let you know what reality dictates.

Thanks,

If you don't go with Microsoft's Foundation Server (there is an entire thread on it from about six months ago), then around $3,000 is probably doable. Something I didn't see on your quote were the CALs. I am sure the server would come with 5 CALs, but then you would need to supply the CALs for the other computers. Of course, it could be cheaper to do user CALs.

Is Dell helping you put this together or are you configuring it yourself. It will likely be cheaper if the latter. Once you get what you want, post it here and let Indy and everyone take a look. Don't listen to me, I will likely add things on.

After you have a price, then go to Dell and ask them to knock it down 15% or so. I am sure they are making much more than that.

Bert,

The swappable hard drives are 90.00 dollars.
The PERC 6/I Cable for Hot Plug Hard Drive is pretty much what it says, I believe that the T300 is a software driven raid set up. The PERC cable is compatable with the RAID set up in this server. (Probably not technically correct), but a friend of mine went to set his dellT300 up in a Raid 5 with swappable drives and it didn't work without this cable.

I am pretty sure you can add a hardware RAID card to the T300. I don't think I would go with software RAID. Ironically, there are a couple of advantages, but you are far better off with hardware RAID.

It appears the original quote includes the RAID controller, which works nicely with the hot-swap drives; you can insert a spare drive, identify it as a hot spare, and if there is a failure within one of the disk sets, the drive get grabbed by the controller and starts getting rebuilt into the array - on the fly.

Tape backup and SinMatic - Just say NO.

I can't remember off hand if the cap on Foundation is 15 or 20 connections to the share, but that is what DQ'd it for a client, as they were already within 1-2 users of the ceiling, then you need a new server OS - no upgrade path.

Another thing to consider in all this is an inexpensive NAS server, and if you don't have it already, a layer 2 (or better) GiG switch. Use the NAS server as near-disk backup, as well as taking images of all your desktop/laptop client machines so that you can restore/reformat/replace a client machine more quickly from a full-disk backup/clone.

If you're having a Topgun performance moment, you can get a 128G Solid State Drive (SSD) for your server OS, paging file, and AC drive partition. [I feel the need .... the need for speed].

Indy, on the software RAID, I was responding to his post about his friend who purchased a T300 and the question of software RAID.

Most definitely the T310 that Tom quoted has a hardware RAID controller. If not, then Dell needs to be reported to the BBB if they are charging $5500 without hardware RAID.

I agree with your NAS, but I have to say I have two RAID5 4TB Buffalo NAS, and I would almost give them away. I don't know why, and I am sure it is my fault, by two months ago I did about 50 test backups, and I feel much better with my eSATA drives being connected directly to my eSATA cards on my server. I had some difficulty with two or three types of backups. Had to always use UNC for full image and file backups, and they didn't work everytime.

So, I still use for backups, but do my complete imaging on my TB SATA drives. Probably just I.

Thanks for your thoughts, questions and input. About 2,000 dollars of the price is really for security/backup. Pricey, but you have to fell good about your back up. The t310 does have a hardware RAID controller. There won't be atape backup. Symantec actually has pretty easily configurable backup software...I certainly wouldn't use Symantec for antiviral/computer security. I'll let you know what I end up with. I'm also looking at wiring the exam rooms and putting stripped down, bare bones desktops in there. I tink Oct is the deadline for XP systems through Dell. That's another topic.

OK, I am little confused on the drives. Correct me if I am wrong. But, the three hot swappable drives are obviously for your server itself. And, they are $90 each. That is rather inexpensive even for the price of drives now.

The removable drives are for backups, correct? How much are they? Let's just say they are a total of $500. That would mean that you are spending $1500 on Symantec? Ouch. I was playing around with Symantec's latest backup software. It just seemed too complicated for me.

I would consider three other programs. BackupAssist is very good backup software for only $249. They do get you a little if you add on SQL module and Exchange. But, it is very easy to configure, works very well. I have used it for over six years.

The other would be Acronis. For a long time, it was rock solid and very easy set up. Now it is rock solid and very difficult setup. But, it is still the best imaging software. It runs around $700 for server.

The other thing to consider is that even though Microsoft makes very, very slow strides toward making good backup software, although a lot of IT people were fine wit ntBackup (which is gone on 2008). But, there imaging backup software is actually rather good and, since it is native to the server, it does a bare metal restore very well. I definitely use it along with Backup Assist.

I still am very, very, wary of Symantec anything. I just think they are the only company that makes Microsoft look good.

And, fill us in on the CALs.

Bert

You are right. The removable hard disks for the RD 1000 are very expensive. This is the area where I can save a bundle. But I do need good backup. I am not one to tweak my system once I buy it. My current server was purchased in 2004, as were my current workstations. All Dells. I did add a hard drive to the server. And currently my backup is less than ideal. Now that I am thinking about going more towards paperless....I think I need a better backup system. I will let you know about the User CALS.

http://www.droboworks.com/default.asp?source=google&gclid=CIXD--Dpy6MCFeh25QodwUhIwA

Tom,

I probably back up more than anyone. And, I have spent too much money due to buying things I don't want now. You definitely need to back up and to be redundant.

It would be helpful to know what the hard disks are running and how much Symantec is. Do you need Symantec? Can you go with just the SBS 2008 backup? Or if you need two, why not Backup Assist with EXTREMELY good support.

I have never used the DroboPro, but I will probably do so one day. Have no idea if it does what it says, but if it does, it seems incredible. Of course, you would have to purchase the eSATA drives, but you could buy them as you go.

I am using the IcyDock with external eSATA drives times 8, all removable. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817198028 Unfortunately, I literally bought the last one without the port multiplier. They don't make the four eSATA cable versions anymore. Bought my second one on eBAY. I sat there and made sure I outbid everyone.

This would put all of your backups in the same place, e.g. server. I am not sure if that is an advantage or disadvantage.

In the end, your setup may be very cool and robust. I don't know because I haven't used it. Do what you feel is best.

hi guys sorry it took so long to get back, bert thanx for the prompt. ryanjo thank you for saving me big bucks, i talked to the IT guy we use and actually copied several posts using updox of course and emailed him the suggestions. he was embarrased that he had not thought of of ethernet cards, and was suprised that several of our less than a year computers did not have gigabite capability, $300 later we are zooming fast. my boss is very pleased. and when the boss is happy, everybody is happy. thank you again

I am glad it worked out for you.