@Roy, I appreciate your comments. Good debate is the essence of the American Experience.
"The existing program on your computer will always remain there on your computer." If this was true, I'd be very satisfied. Your assumption is not true. The EULA states that AC has the right to pull the existing program off your computer! You could be court ordered (or have your program deactivated remotely). Did you know that?
I think an important distinction must be made. A EULA which CLAIMS they can go into my computer and delete something, is very different from the REALITY that they cannot. I have a Cisco Pix 501 harware Firewall, which virtually 100% blocks anyone from getting into my server. Even if they get into my server, I have a second network adapter in my server that they must traverse a software firewall in order to get on my network. Even IF they manage to do that, they cannot delete anything without logging into my server. They will never guess the pass-phrase. So they'll never get into my server. So I'm not worried about AC hacking into my computer to delete anything.
Secondly, we all must remember a VERY important point. Patients' charts (whether paper or digitized) belong to the
patient. While we own the computer hardware or the paper upon which the information is recorded, the
patient owns the information. Therefore, it would be illegal for AC to deliberately delete or otherwise destroy the patients' information.
It is generally the responsibility of a vendor of a medical record to assist in converting data for exportation (unless of course a member has not purchased the AC's Angel Guardian Support). So IF they make it subscription, and IF a users says F#*& That!, then AC will need to help make the data usable so that user can export it to another database. If they refused to help, and you lost your data as a result, you have a very nice lawsuit on your hands. ALL of your patients have a very nice lawsuit on their hands as well.
For these reasons, I think AC would be stupid for simply deleting our information.
By the way, you are keeping backups right? They simply cannot find all of your remote backup media (DVD's, CD's, thumb drives, FTP sites, external hard drives). Your information would still maintain its integrity.
So will they delete your program? Maybe, but I doubt it. Will they delete mine...I've got enough security to be confident in its integrity. Therefore, I pose the following challenge to anyone on this Board: try to hack into my computer and delete AC. I guarantee anyone will fail.
For someone like me who has over seven years of data on AC, having this program yanked out is not acceptable. If it happens, it will lead to legal repercussions. I would rather avoid such an event and that is why I am bringing up this issue.
I am Importing ALL of my paper charts, and throwing the paper into the dumpster. If AC falters, I'm done for good. Plus my patients will hate me losing their records. I agree, having the program yanked is unacceptable. However, it is for the legal repercussions that you mention why I believe Dr Bertman will never physically remove your program which you purchased under the OLD EULA.
I would not mind updating my Amazingchart (and paying the yearly fee which is very reasonably priced), but not at a cost that the new upgrade would mean that I will have a meaningless database should Jon or his sucessor want to charge $10,000 a year for the privilege of accessing my data.
While I don't recall seeing anything about raising the cost to $10,000 for AC, that is rather steep for me. I'd rather keep my records as MS Word documents than pay $10,000 for any EMR. I will happilly pay the updates, no problem for me.
Now, I can see you rolling your eyes. It has happened to me several times.
I'm not rolling my eyes. I can see the point of your argument, however I do not feel all points are reasonable or likely. Maybe you are right and AC becomes a horrible program. Maybe you are right and they raise the price to $10,000/year.
One thing for certain is change.
Yu are clearly right in that change is inevitable. I sincerely hope that AC's change is a positive one, not a negative one. I think we could all give Dr. Bertman and AC a fair chance to prove they have everyone's better interests in mind, NOT just money.
So, all I am asking for is some assurances that the program that is currently in my computer would not be disabled by AC.
Keep your network server robust, and keep plenty of backups on hand. These are good practices anyway, and will prevent AC from disabling anything....unless they remove your license. Only that case your product will not work properly. However again, you have patient data on your computer. This is not YOURS and is not AC's. The data belongs to patients. They must allow for patients to get their data off your computer. If they don't, then sue them.
It's hard to go on and invest my time in a program that can't give assurance that it won't just disappear into thin air.
With all respect Roy, ultimately for those of us that don't like a program have the authority to cancel our subscription and use a different program.
@Bert
With all due respect, AC is NOT going to remove your program from your computer. Period. End of story. No matter what it says in the EULA.
I agree. AC won't do it. In my case, they CAN'T do it. If they terminate my license, then they have the responsibility to convert that patient data into another format such that my patients can still access their data. Vinny said on a post that the lawyers got to John. They made him put in things that will have little impact on use. I will believe this. I must believe this. I have no choice but to believe it.
@Paul,
Bert, If that was absolutely true, then why can't we just have it in writing? I've yet to see a contract or lease with strange clauses that were not there with a purpose. Why is it in there? If it is not to be used, threatened or what have you, than simply take out the part of the termination clause about removing any and all copies of AC from a users system and machines.
I am wondering how worried Dr. Bertman is about this forum? He may see only a very few small minority. He might figure that AC can afford to lose a few members, if they can gain thousands more.
I am simply bewildered as to why folks think that something that somebody took time and effort to create, understanding that it may raise a few eyebrown and turn off some people and therefore loose a few customers, why folks think and feel that it is not in there with a purpose and intent???
I agree with you Paul, there may be purpose and intent. However, the intent may not be the one you presuppose. I won't guess or speculate what that intent may be. However, some more specific clarification from Dr. Bertman sounds in order. Obviously there is some confusion on this matter.
While Microsoft TECHNICALLY could inactivate my programs, they won't do it. Why? Because I comply with their EULA. I have to maintain the same degree of trust in AC as I do Microsoft. Microsoft WANTS my business. AC WANTS your business. They won't have YOUR business or MINE if they raise the price to $10,000 or create roadblocks or go deactivating people's copies of the program. Word will get out, and no one will use AC.
Fear not, God will show us the way.
@Bert
This language was most likely put in there by attorneys. And, simply because it is there, does not mean it is enforceable. From the posts I read, it doesn't sound like some are as concerned about the license agreements and its implications as they are angry with Jon that he won't remove it.
I think there is a lot of emtion running wild. Let's see what happens with V4. Ultimately, if you like your current version, keep using it. Don't pay for updates and just keep the current program. You all joined under one EULA, which contained fine print. Sounds like you all read the fine print. I have not read it until afterward.
I've never read a EULA previously. I always agree to the EUlA's, otherwise you can't active said computer program.
I don't base my decision on whether to subscribe to Amazing Charts based on the company's demeanor but rather on the fact that it is the best software out there fore the money. Again, that doesn't mean I agree with the EULA. It is just a reality I have come to.
I agree with you Bert, completely.
Finally, I see all of you as colleagues and do not think any less of you because I may disagree with your positions. If we all agreed, life wouldn't be interesting. I hope there are no hard feelings.
Respectfully submitted.
