Home Forums Discussions General Discussion Status of AC update to version "7"

Wendel,

We have been told that "there is no direct link" between AC and ezclaims. If that is true , why was I told to use it as a stop gap. In addition, the main page of AC , in the practice management area does not have an asterick, signifying "Systems listed in the table below without an asterisk (*) have direct interfaces to Amazing Charts". When we had support on our system yesterday, they could not explain why it doesn't work. Therefor we have been communicating with someone at AC regrading this issue.

There is no requirement to be on support until open release. "Once a beta version is considered stable and without any significant problems, it is made available on our website for existing clients (who subscribe to our Guardian Angel Support & Maintenance service), as well as any new clients wishing to use it. The release candidate remains in open beta status until such time as we are confident that there are no outstanding critical issues. Critical issues are problems that could inadvertently cause harm to a patient or cause patient information to become lost or incorrectly saved."

My staff and I have spent many "uncompensated hours" on this product. We are not dogs and do not need bones!

As you don't have our system, you need not comment on being dumped out of our system. We have contacted support about this issue, w/o resolution many times (62 tickets)

So endeth the lesson (Jimmy Moran who I believe was from Chicago . The Untouchables)

That's my main issue at this point. I can be patient and wait for V7 with PM as long as I have a realistic timeline. If AC would just say, "We've bitten off more than we can chew and PM is on the backburner until 2014. Sorry," then fine. I would move along with another PM and not look back. However, there is no chance that I'm going to throw thousands at another PM system when I know that I'll go with AC's as soon as it arrives, possibly a few months from now.

AC admin, just give us an educated guess on when V7 will be out rather than a best case scenario or wish. We won't bite.

If soon, I'll happily plug along with OA double-entry and save the overhead while continuing 'The Great Wait.'

I agree with Bama Doc,

I have been waiting for a PM (as many others have and you can search the forum about this) since 2009. I have been repeatedly told "6 months". It's hard to plan for the upcoming year that way.

"Do or do not, there is no try" Yoda.

AC and University Physician's Network in NYC have a firm commitment timeline for AC hookup to UPN's HIE. This hookup is promised to be complete with release of Ver. 7. March 15 is the date that both parties have agreed to. Our practice MUST have this hookup or we lose membership in UPN, as do ~10 other practices.
Hope this helps.
Marc

Sorry, it is not going to happen.

I no experience with a HIE, but why is a practice management component in AC necessary for a hookup? Why can't you hook up with 6.3.3 or 6.5?

I would imagine anything needed for an HIE that isn't in 6.3.3 would be in 6.5. What am I missing?

"Wonders never cease", my 96 year old Grandmother used to say, but that HIE interface is far more likely than v7 going production by March 15.

Not to suggest that you are wrong, there SHOULD be no problem hooking up to any HIE, but, in practice, it's not as easy at it should be. Building out the interface has been a challenge, from what I understand, as well as the challenge of satisfying both parties.
My understanding from AC is this will be in version 7. No relationship to PM component.
I didn't make this up from whole cloth.
good luck to us all
Marc

EZClaims DOES have a direct connect from AC. One of the problems is that I don't think it is 2 way (it's been a while since I used it)
V7 is NOT considered a stable beta, I believe it is still Phase 1. That is why it was selectively put out for beta. It was never on the website for general release. My understanding was that you have to be enrolled in support services. (Under the 6.3.3 beta (which is now an official release) it states "DO NOT USE THE DATABASE TUNER IF YOU ARE NOT A CURRENT SUBSCRIBER TO OUR SUPPORT SERVICES."

I am not disagreeing with most of what you say. I too have been waiting for a very long time for PM to be completed.

Where we disagree is that you are complaining about a beta that is not stable and feel that you should be compensated. My feeling is that you should know what you are getting into when you choose to beta. Some beta's (probably like the current 6.5) may be very stable but V7 was never touted as being such. It has been quite stable for me but not for you, such is the nature of computer programs (or I have friendlier computers ).

This is just speculation, based on what I know: the main purpose of V7 was to introduce PM. It has been postponed, with no stated timeline to release. While there was to be no version between 6.3.3 and 7, the long time interval between the two has led to the realization that an interim version is necessary. That will be 6.5. It will not include PM, but will include an assortment of other useful changes. Perhaps...maybe...those changes will include the connectivity feature that you are looking for. If so, it might be available by 3/15/13. If not, and what you need is actually in V7, then you may have a problem.

Marc, I know that this has been a long, difficult process for you. I would suggest that you contact AC immediately and find out if you are waiting for V6.5 or 7.

And if Dr. B is listening, it would be really helpful to get a status update right about now regarding V7 (among other things).

Regular communication from AC to us, the end users, is very helpful. I greatly appreciate the status updates that Dr. Bertman has posted here and on the AC website. The last update was 11/20/12. Two months is a LONG time--especially considering all the questions raised by the last update.

Updates don't even have to be concrete, good news. It's just helpful to hear a simple, "Yes, we hear your concerns and we are working on it. This is what we're doing to resolve the issues....." No news often becomes interpreted as bad news and leads to all sorts of speculation as this thread illustrates.

Here s a "what if" question...

Suppose that what we are hearing is really the death rattle of AC as we know it? After all, you can't realistically sell something and demand that the new partners keep your vision...
What happens if we just keep our version 6.3 running indefinitely without support?

As we are not in the group that looks to meeting government mandates and MU, I can only think of a few things, given a probable 5 year horizon and no need for a huge change in the operating system:

1) Electronic prescribing might quit. This would be a nuisance, not a catastrophe.
2) UpDox might no longer be there for us. A much bigger nuisance.
3) We might not be able to import labs from Quest. We could revert to faxes.

What else am I missing?

I read Dr. Bertman's post twice. I think it's over. They added the person to field and handle the questions. That's all to it. I just wondering how any person in clear mind would chose AC after reading all these posts. I tried to promote AC anywhere I went. Now I feel guilty - what if somebody followed my advise and bought it. I think the issue at hand is how we can transfer all records from AC format to other EHR. Btw, where is Bert?

this is a long, and very diffuse thread. I have been reading it since about Christmas, and I have yet to find much clarity here.

At least one doctor in town (a surgeon) uses practice fusion, and loves it -- mostly because it's free. He doesn't put out coherent notes, and doesn't use any of the features that make AC work well in a small FP office. He could care less if someone datamines his patients' info. He doesn't care if he has the data in his office-- doesn't really care if it all just goes away, I suspect -- and doesn't care if the Internet goes down -- which it does with some regularity out here on the coast. He is almost retired, anyway.

I am looking for V7.0 to be cloud-based with PM integrated and datamining by Pri-Med. That's what they do best, of course. V6.5 is likely to be the last of the versions we can actually have on our own servers, and I don't suppose it will be supported indefinitely, especially if 7.0 in the cloud actually takes off.

Medware works fine for a PM solution. Of course, there is some double entry involved, but for the most part it is just an alt-tab between programs. And of course, with Medware, you don't get a general ledger program, so you also have to add Quickbooks.

The three together (plus UpDox and Dragon) get us by quite efficiently -- full integration would entail a far more expensive program, constant glitches if my previous experience with the "integrated" programs is any guide, expensive updates, major problems every time Medicare needed to add or subtract a new field -- which they do all the time, and unpredictably.

I will take sure reality over an IT wet dream.

P.S. Our hospital is switching from CPSI/Chartlink to Cerner at $MILLIONS -- and the switchover is expected to take a YEAR! Anyone want to guess what things will look like in a year?

I have been an advocate of AC also. I have even brought physicians into my office and done demos.

I sent the following email:

"Christine,

Congratulations on your new position.

Plain and simple, What is going on with Version 7, the practice management module and when can we expect it?

There are many practices who use AC looking to find out what is going on and when.

Hopefully, your post this week on the user board can help."

Hopefully, more information is on the way.

I don't think things are quite so bad. Yes, some mistakes have been made on AC's part. The first was biting off more than they could chew with practice management. Perhaps Jon B and the developers may have reached a point where they must decide whether this is a project that requires further tweaking and postponement, or whether it will require a more fundamental rewrite of the program code. This is largely speculation on my part, but I suspect that this is the reason for the silence regarding release dates. In any case, the delay or even failure to develop a practice management module would not be the death knell of AC, even if that were to occur. Sure, we all can't survive without a process to do our billing, and we would love to have it integrated into Amazing Charts. Meanwhile, we all have some other process in place for getting it done. It would obviously be helpful for Amazing Charts to share with us more about what the plans are for ultimate release of the product, but in the meantime, we can make do with what we have. There is no reason to consider abandoning the EMR.

A second issue is a lack of communication. Or perhaps a better way of putting it would be "a failure to recognize how important communication is to the rest of us". For years, both on this board and in private, users have requested some sort of regular communication from the company, perhaps in the form of a newsletter or regular emailing of news. The brief updates here by Jon B are worthwhile, but they are not enough for many of us. This need is especially acute now, with the uncertainty surrounding the sale to Pri-Med. Further, most of us are solo or small practice docs, surrounded by the great majority of our colleagues who now work either for a hospital or for a big group, using bulky, expensive EMR's. We are generally out here on our own, to some extent relying on AC and the community of other users. Regular communication from the company is therefore particularly important. I think that Jon B recognizes this to some extent but underestimates its importance. This problem could certainly be fixed much more easily and inexpensively than the first one. Hopefully the addition of a director of product strategy represents a course change in terms of communication as well.

The purchase by Pri-Med raises an additional set of issues. We are left to wonder what the future holds. Perhaps there is some turmoil and anxiety at company headquarters as well. I came away from discussions with a couple of Pri-Med people and Jon B at the Pri-Med meeting in December with the opinion that the company will go forward, much as it has, with the addition of some much-needed assets. I don't think I am being na?ve about this. While I recognize that some disruption is inevitable, I do believe the final outcome will be a favorable one.

So is the "AC apocalypse" coming? Keeping in mind that I am speaking to a group whose motto might be "you can't have too many backups", I think it's perfectly natural to think about other strategies. On the other hand, I don't think this is a time where we need to implement a disaster plan. Some of these issues can be put to rest fairly quickly and easily; others may take a little time. Meanwhile, the end is NOT near.

1 - could be replaced by another stand-alone vendor and/or interface
2 - Updox supports a multitude of other EMRs, so I see this as less likely
3 - Quest's interface has it's challenges, but it is in their best interest to deliver results electronically as a matter of competition

One issue is support for the legacy WinXP, Win7 OSs as time marches on. The good news there is that with Linux virtualization, those fine systems can live on in perpetuity; it will be increasingly important to isolate them from the wide world to keep them safe.

AC, of what ever version you choose, can live long into the future.

So what will the overall penalties be to be olde school i.e. no eRx, no data access, no MU etc ? I am seriously considering trying to see 1 or 2 more patients a day and saying good bye to reaching for the 'golden ring'.

Every Physician and their practice is different, but as the rules continue to change, there are mounting reasons for each to do an assessment of their practice model, and what payer money to take.

Having been in the forefront of data-mining implementation in a certain group of F500 companies, I remember when one of those companies looked at what we found, and exited an entire line-of-business. They discovered they were loosing money, and were better off not taking the business.

The salient point is that saying no to certain business/payers will be disruptive, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't do it.

This info makes me rest easier.

I've been on the fence for months as to how I plan to handle Meaningful Use 2 and the ACO push and I've been leaning towards the status quo, letting the hospital-owned practices learn the tough lessons and test the waters first before attempting a change in my practice based on their failures and successes.

If my current version of AC (glitch-free since the upgrade) can continue on without support should disaster happen with the AC company, I'm good.

Hi everyone,

A question about the possibility of eventually running AC without support:

Several users, including myself, have experienced extreme slowness of AC when the internet connection is not available. It seems that AC needs to "check in with home" before it will start. This is a problem even with interaction checking turned off.

Would this be the case if AC no longer supported my version? If so, then AC would be close to useless.

Thanks. Gene

There is actually a series of workarounds to solve those, as they say on the airplane, "In the unlikely event ...."

I would like to assume that I am in a significant majority of AC users that would not start depending on the PM component of v7 for most of a year after it comes out. Happy to have it, but I am on v18 of MediSoft, and have more than a decade of trust built up in it. I don't want to go thru a mutiny or have trouble meeting payroll. When it is available, v7 will have to slowly earn my trust.

As a newbie, my impression of AC is that it started out like a garage build dune buggy, lean and fast. Over time it is evolving to be a tank with every bell and whistle government and competition requires, able to handle anything.

My biggest problem with AC is it is slower than I hoped. Why should I see hourglasses when trying to write a prescription. We don't see that with other programs, ever.

I appreciate the complexity of a big league EHR. I don't want my data offsite. I like that it didn't cost $50k to get into this. What little programming I have done, humbles me to think of the hurdles ahead for AC and how far it has come.

If AC stays true to a simple, intuitive approach to charting, I would be happy with a PM whenever.

Yes Dan!

Keep it simple. Not easy with CMS issuing new rule and "guidelines" all the time.

Practice Fusion is not a solution
Epic and the other biggies I have seen really suck from the doctor's perspective, however much the administration and the IT department like them.

It is pretty easy in a small practice to use separate medical records and practice management. It was that way in the old paper days. Integration just sometimes brings additional complexity.

Indy,

Are you saying that you have a fix for slow AC without internet now, or that you will work your magic in the future if necessary?

Thanks. Gene

Hi everyone.
Brief update.
I just got off the phone with Michael Kerr, regional manager for AC. He says that AC is aware of all of these concerns. There will be an update from management posted on the user board in the next few days.
The plan is to release ver 6.5 March 1 2013. this will contain the HIE link with UPN as was conjectured in this thread. Ver 7, who knows? Hopefully info will be in management posting.
Thanks,
Marc

Right here Easy Rider You know Leslie has said it over and over, "Be careful what you wish for." I won't go out on a limb yet, and I don't know if AC running under Pri-Med would be horrible.

I do know that AC was humming along, making money, and kicking [censored] before three things came along: CCHIT, MU and v7. Well, as much as I didn't do and despise MU, the first two were pretty much necessary. I have never, ever understood v7 and PM. So many on here have clamored for it. The Big81 is now almost two years old and we have yet to see a folder change in Imported Items. As Dan said, he has used Medisoft forever. I have used Medware for 6 and 1/2 years, and there has not been ONE bug EVER! And, no I am not jinxing it. It is rock solid and bullet proof.

Think back to the eRx debacle and the TPS800 StarMicronics printer screw-up. Not only did this go on for weeks to months, there was no communication on it. Could you really go without your receivables (sorry no idea about billing) for a month. Billing software is five times more important than an EHR. Hell, I could do paper again for a month. My biller isn't going to go out and buy a notebook. AC has made a great EHR. And, with the way it has been designed and for the cost, we all expect some bugs and glitches. But, you can't have a glitch in a PM. To make a bad analogy, I could build a really good, fast, inexpensive bike whose pedals fall off every so often. But, that doesn't mean I could build an airplane. Wings falling off just doesn't cut it.

I will never understand (and this is just me) why we had to have PM.

Bert, it is not just you. We have had this conversation over and over and over. I had the conversation with Jon and Kathleen. Don't do the PM if you cannot do it right and do not promise things which you cannot deliver. Stick with what you do best. Be content being a small fish in a big sea...blah, blah, blah, and, yes, be careful what you wish for. The principle things that attracted most of us early on to AC were the simplicity, the communication, the interaction, the sense our needs were being listened to, and of course the price. The AC of today has almost no semblance (IMO) of that AC with which I fell in love. I have used the same PM program for almost 16 years and can count on one hand the number of times I have had to call tech support. I tried being a beta tester for ACs V7 and knew in less than one week there was no way the PM would work for me, no way it would be superior to what I am currently doing, so I ditched it. I have met a lot of terrific people via AC and made a number of friends (and enemies) but I do not have the passion for the program I once did. I do not blame them for the course they have taken, the business world is a tough one, and I may be taking a similar course. But it is not the same and never will be and I pine for it.

Hi I was asked by Michel Kerr to correct my prev post, The release date is "sometime in the beginning of March" not March 1.
Sorry, Thanks

I hope I am not an enemy. Actually, we go way back. And, this isn't a mod being too hard on AC. I wish AC could just say that v7 was a great learning experience. Most successful businesses faily because they branch out too far. IMO, v7 is and was a colossal mistake. WHY did we need Medisoft all over again. We didn't reinvent SureScripts.

I want to go back. I want the Big81.

What is the Big81 ?

Jon? John?

If they don't answer, I will. I wrote them, lol. Just search for it.

Hi Bert,

Now you have me curious. Search of this board showed nothing except this thread. Google was unhelpful as well.

Please enlighten us!

Thanks.

Gene

The answer to all of your hopes and dreams.

Bert conducted a poll of users some time ago, attempting to identify and prioritize the features and fixes that people wanted to see in Amazing Charts. Unfortunately, few, if any, of those changes ever came to fruition. At some point Bert named the list "The Big 81".
Here is the poll.

Oh, and this was sanctioned by AC.

Can everyone answer the question, "Where would AC be right now if PM was never thought of?

And, why does AC have to have a PM to survive.

@James Great post, really. But, I would refer to Bertman as Dr. Bertman. v7 or not, I think he deserves that. Hashtag: It takes 11 years to become a doctor and over 10 years to get to v6. Hashtag2 It takes 11 more years to get to v7.

@Paul You write some of the most astute, well thought out, intelligent posts on the board. Unfortunately, we don't have time to read them. Hashtag: Shorten them just a tad.

Please don't take that personally.

My thoughts:

We have to be realistic about our expectations at the price we pay. AC needs 60 doctors a year ($1000/Dr.) to pay for one *ENTRY* level programmers salary (~60K). Putting these sorts of pressures on them will lead to a poor and unfinished product. We've all seen it before. A company tries taking too much on its plate and ends up failing. We've seen some of the repercussions with them trying to implement all the MU stuff, ePrescribe, etc. Do you really think Practice fusion only makes $1000 dollars a doctor with the ads? Those sort of target groups are what advertisers dream of. I personally wouldn't be surprised if it were 5-10 times that. Google is making billions with a shotgun approach.

You might be wondering how big companies like Microsoft and Adobe do it, but they already have an established market. I'd imagine we'll see rapid development on par with those companies once AC gets big enough. That's assuming small practices are still around in a few years. The ones around me are disappearing very quickly.

Thanks JBS for the 81 info

This may be wishful thinking but my guess is that we are on the upswing or near the crescent of the sine curve of small practices disappearing.
I believe our medical community is a microcosm of USA anywhere with a few variations.
Most of the glorified salaries utilized to attract physicians to become employed by the hospital 2-3 years ago are being re-negotiated with most hospitals more dependent on outpatient services/providers for revenue stream and workloads and expectations are ever mounting.

I predict with the technology available today, the EHR that can meet the needs of smaller groups of physicians 10 and under to remain efficient and viable will not only survive but excel.

It may look a bit bleak with small practices disappearing, but I think over the next several years there will be a significant influx back to a smaller practice style with more autonomy, especially primary care physicians who have chosen not to continue with inpatient medicine.

I think AC will do just fine in this milieu and will continue to grow.

Having a product with a PM, will meet a certain % of current AC users needs, but a large % may never utilize the AC PM, but the inherent simplicity and intuitive workability of AC IMHO is hard to beat. And having my own patient data on site is nearly as precious as the dusty certificate that sits over my desk.