Home Forums Discussions General Discussion SBS is dead! Microsoft moves completely to cloud.

Bert,

That's almost what MS did. There are only a few server editions now rather than almost twelve.

Windows Server 2012 Datacenter
Windows Server 2012 Standard
Windows Server 2012 Essentials
Windows Server 2012 Storage Edition

Storage Edition is, of course, only sold with an OEM machine. The rest can be retail.

You should read Aidan Finn's blog on the details. Windows Server is much cheaper now.

JamesNT

I still think it is too much and the words, Datacenter, Essentials and Storage Edition are confusing. People understand things like XP Home and XP Pro.

It isn't cheaper when you add Exchange and SQL and you lose SharePoint that used to integrated perfectly with AC.

Why not have Standard which includes SQL, and if you want Exchange, SharePoint and Office, you can use the cloud.

Then have Premium which would have all of those combined.

And yes I have read his blog.

Not saying you're wrong, just sayin'

It would be cool to have an Essentials On-Premises Package/Add-On (SharePoint, Exchange, not SQL). That way if people aren't liking the cloud/require on premises, it'll be easy to move up. SQL still sold separately. That way it would be at least equivalent to the old SBS package. The previous Premium Add-On was like $200 cheaper than buying SQL and Server 2008R2 separately so I wouldn't be too disappointed if that disappeared. That's all it was too in the package. Nothing preconfigured.

Lol as a side note. Macs are insanely expensive. I hope AC doesn't ever make that their main platform.

What I especially dislike is that current June 2012 Mac Pros are using processors from 2 years ago. These would likely be the "servers".

Why not to get a Mac? (I've done one of these before lol.)

Not trying to start a war here, but I find it funny people expect a $400 HP Pavillion to be as good as a MacBook Pro (which starts @ $1200). More often than not, hardware problems are blamed on Microsoft when the only hardware they actually package is the Xbox Gaming Console.

To backup Sandeep:

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthing/archive/2003/08/28/54719.aspx

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/magazine/2006.10.windowsconfidential.aspx

JamesNT

Just want to reiterate what Sandeep said or what I think he is saying. At least I am saying it. Apple is a great company and found a niche` that is almost a cult following. By integratig the OS and the hardware, they did two things.

They made it impossible to tinker with the hardware and, therefore, upgrade it or "break it" and they made it bulletproof. Some people like Macs like I like nVidia. Wouldn't ever purchase an ATI Radeon card. The problem is they are so expensive, it doesn't always make sense for a company to cater to them.

But, like Sandeep said, the white flag is up. This isn't about PC vs Mac. We already saw that on TV, and the fat guy got destroyed.

I like both NVidia and ATI. ATI tends to offer better price/performance. I have crossfire 6950s. The thing I don't like about Mac is they offer the budget ATI card as the top model with a huge markup. That card can't really play any games at high resolutions.

Macs still experience hardware failure. They are just better at handling it with the centralized control and fixed hardware. Makes people think they are more reliable, but their hard drives fail at the same rate as any other PC.

But where MAC wins out is their marketing and their sleek-looking products. You and I would take substance over aesthetics (not that the substance is better), but even with the iPhone. At the time (and still), it was an innovative product, but you still have to admit it was one beautiful phone compared with the ones on the market for other phones. Especially when the other OS choices were Windows, Blackberry, Palm, etc. Wasn't until Android that there was even a competitor.

Also with the Apple store, developers who charge should be forced to sell the trial and have you purchase the key after as with Touchdown for Exchange. Trying to trial it and then get your money back 15 minutes later is insane. Someone should set up a small website/broker that would take care of that. Also, do away with the reviews. They are all fours and fives unless the thing doesn't work on their Evo, then they complain. Just do thumbs up, thumbs down.

Mac requires you to buy their special hardware and pay fanboi prices. For our developer business to release on iOS , it's mandatory, so we do it in certain instances.

Now that you can get a Octa-core, top-of-the -line processor, 32G of memory, and high-end video in a solid build for $1000 or so, it just becomes a question of what OS to you want to work from as your host? Like choosing car colors - some cost more than others, but you can choose. Unless you want a Mac, then you must do what The Apple says.

My new Galaxy III should ship today. I suspect that it will not only out-look, but out-function any iToy. Then I can root my trusty X and try and get ICS on it.

Like I said choose your client OS; including Android.

There's no single unifying theme for Windows that they can market. They have the basic pc all the way up to the hard core workstations. That's the wonderful thing about Windows. Versatility and a large driver base. You can customize everything down to the case. For instance, I love my Corsair 650D which I have completely maxed out. Installed custom LED strips and have it customized just the way I like it. That's the wonderful thing about building your own. The selection is massive. Hell you can probably buy a Mac Pro case if you like it that much.

I already have the Galaxy Nexus, Verizon's flagship phone with integrated Ice Cream Sandwich and soon to be Jelly Bean, although no rush for that small of an update.

I am one who has never owned an Apple product, but no one can refute their innovation and committment to quality. The Galaxy Nexus, III, S2, etc would still be Motorola flip phones and Nokia ugly phones all of them dumb had Steve Jobs not created the iPhone. It is now the number one used phone for physicians.

And, while MAC users don't have choice, they have already made their choice. Like the analogy with the car. They may take the Porsche in red over any other car in the color they want.

There are just two sides here.

The PC can be Corolla or a Bugatti or anything in between. The choice is yours. While the Porsche is fantastic, it's no Bugatti Then again, it's definitely better than a Corolla.

The funny thing is that the Bugatti will be cheaper than the Porsche.

Unfortunately, Susan Bradley ("The SBS 'Diva'") seems pretty confident that Microsoft won't be changing their mind.

Unless they make her CEO and get rid of Steve Ballmer

How can anyone take this guy seriously after watching this video?

Lol, ahh the irony at the end of this interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxxF5bl37oA&feature=related

If SBS is dead then half the stickies on this discussion forum are dead.

The Bert-Sandeep show is getting old.

Bert should step down as moderator. He is too reactive (who is Tom and why did Bert initiate a thread asking if Tom has a "pipeline to Redmond" on this forum?). Bert seems like an intelligent person, but is simply too reactive. He bans people after baiting them and then deletes the posts he wrote in order to absolve himself. He then posts a poll about the ban (entitled, provocatively enough, "Ban"), which only adds fuel to the fire. And then he deletes that thread (thankfully).

I'd like him to stay on as a contributor, but as a mod? No.

Can we come to our senses here, folks? This hysteria is enough to drive people away from AC and to cloud EHR solutions like Pr*ctice Fusion.

And before anyone says I am a shill for PF, rest assured: I do not want to trust my patients' data to them, and my access to that data to my ISP.

Microsoft is announcing Office 365 Open for those partners looking for a solution to replace SBS.

http://www.aidanfinn.com/?p=13134

JamesNT

LOOKING FORWARD

If you?re in a very small business, 25 users or less, get used to the word ?Essentials.? We?ll be using it instead of ?Small Business Server? to refer to the Microsoft system that will run your business. Whether you get the current version or the Server 2012 version, you?ll be getting solutions that are well suited to your needs.

If you?re in a larger business, or you?re adding additional servers for line of business programs or databases, the new Server 2012 lineup might come at a lower price than current Windows Server products. Far more important, though, is the new technology in Server 2012, which has been built for the future. Windows Server 2012 is designed to be centrally managed and to be virtualized, two trends that are rapidly changing network architecture. This release will move Microsoft far ahead of any competitors on the server side.

In some ways Microsoft?s new server lineup will have an even bigger impact on the industry than Windows 8, but that won?t be very apparent to consumers. The key takeaway is that Microsoft continues to look like a company that has found the focus it has been lacking for years. We are building up to an explosion at the end of the year when Microsoft may leave Apple and Google looking like laggards who are a step behind. Things may be unsettled right now but hoo, boy, is this an exciting time to watch this industry!

http://www.brucebnews.com/2012/07/microsoft-reshapes-the-server-market/

Lol Marlene, the new AndreChuk ( the old AndreChuk /:| )?

Bert's banned what like 2 users (spammers aside) in the last 8 years? I'd hardly call that "too reactive".

I don't think our discussion of Microsoft's Small Business Server Lineup will drive people away from Amazing Chart's EHR considering that the overwhelming majority are using Windows 7 servers and it's not really relevant to AC...

Nice try, Sandeep. Take it to to the Tech forum and stop scaring new users away from AC. You have been asked before, and nicely. Next time I will go directly to Wendell365.

Please do. I'm pretty sure I can demonstrate relevance more easily than you can prove my posts are abusive.

I'm pretty sure I've kept and brought in more users than I've scared away...

Your voice on those Youtube SBS tutorials has scared away more potential AC users than any relevance you might imagine you have demonstrated here.

And I don't want to get all ad hominem here. I respect both you and Bert. This is a discussion, and I have made the points I wanted to make. I thank everyone here for their contributions, and I hope we can keep an open dialogue. There is always something to be said.

Clearly, you do with that comment above about my voice. Anyways, you're always welcome to state your opinion. I will just say I respectfully disagree.

You're clearly trying to bait me. Now, I'll be the bigger man (ironic now isn't it?) and walk away.

Walk away to the Tech forum, please. The damage you have done here is incalculable and the hysteria of this thread is ridiculous. It's not how your voice sounds (and I honestly thought you put it through a distortion algorithm for the sake of privacy). What matters is what you say, not how it sounds. Re-read my LOOKING FORWARD link (above) and digest that before responding again, please.

Hi Sandeep,

I find it ironic that just when Steve Ballmer announces that SBS is going to be dropped from the Server line and be replaced with Office365, forcing users to the cloud, they announce Office 2013.

Obviously, it will make a lot of money on users who are not in a network, it just seems like a step backward. And, to be fair, they can still use Office365.

By the way, I tried 2013, and there is little different with it except OneNote and Word have a direct path to Sky Drive. More clouds.

Large corporations have no plans to move to the cloud anytime soon. They would loose a lot of big customers forcing 365 down their throats. So much wasted bandwith for them to use Cloud Services. Not to mention pricey. Unfortunately, the voice of the SBS community is small compared to these guys.

I'm sure they added some advanced functions that 1% of users would actually use ha. Maybe some new formatting styles here and there as well.

I'm not a fan of the Metro interface on Server 2013 Essentials. It's good if all you do is use the basic functions of Essentials. I like to tweak things so I'm not a fan.

For Server 2012, my plans are to DUMP the GUI entirely and go straight for PowerShell.

By the way, I do hope that Amazing Charts is truly paying attention to the fact that for Server 2012, they are NOT guaranteed the presence of a GUI.

JamesNT

Just when I change to SBS Essentials, you are telling me SBS is DEAD?
I can't imagine sending all my patient data to a "cloud" -- and expect it to remain confidential, or even reliably accessible. Internet service is pretty good here -- but hardly 100%.

This whole thread is very confusing to me.

1. Who is Marlene, and why is she upset?
2. Marlene asks "who is Tom" -- that might be me, a simple family doc from the North Coast who has no beef with anyone. Just trying my best to take care of patients, and if hardware/software will help, then I'm happy. I still haven't fully integrated the idea that electronics is an improvement over my old paper charts, but I'm getting better at it, and I do see some value.
3. What is the source of the ad hominem attacks "you have done incalculable damage" for example. What sort of nonsense is that?

SBS Essentials isn't dead. It lives on as Server 2012 Essentials. The price is about the same. Feature set is about the same, except it's supposed to be a more locked down version of Server 2012. You don't have all the features. The old Essentials had a fully featured Server 2008R2 core. Also, it's more tightly integrated with Office 365.

SBS Standard ($750) is dead. It can be replaced with Server 2012 ($800)+Exchange 2010($1200)+SharePoint Foundation 2010 (Free).

Previous Essentials users aren't being forced to the cloud per se. You'll still have on-site AD, File Server, Fax Server, etc. However, previous Standard users are being forced to use SBS Essentials+Office 365. Or bite the bullet and get Server 2012+Exchange 2010 (For nearly triple the cost).

SBS Standard Replacement Scenarios Outlined Here:
http://amazingcharts.com/ub/ubbthreads.php/topics/46909/No_more_Exchange_with_SBS_Solu#Post46909

Tom,

Obviously, you missed the goings on from May 4 on. I am responsible for getting you involved as a joke. The day that Steve (ruin Microsoft) Ballmer announced everything was moving to the cloud, I was indicating that you had already made that move. You may not use the cloud, but that is the whole idea of Essentials.

OK--

I'm happy with what I have, which is Essentials (I don't know if 2011 or 2011-- it's whatever Newegg sold me.

What Microsoft is doing seems like extortion, but who am I to pass judgement on them?

A shame this can't be done with Linux -- but ever since I have gotten into the EMR business; first at the hospital and now the office, I have had to abandon Linux for MSFT.
A real shame.

And I don't want my patients files in the "cloud." I don't trust it.

Tom

Not sure about Newegg, but 2011 will always be equal to 2011.

But, on the serious side, I am pretty certain you have SBS 2011 Essentials, which was a very good choice.

I guess you might save with management costs, but setup costs will be higher. SBS Standard was often criticized for putting too much on one box. With the two virtualization licenses, it'll be easier to maintain best practices.

Though I really wish they weren't scrapping it.

Digging this back up now that some serious time has passed.

Sandeep, where we at with all this from your perspective?

JamesNT

Not so sure this is the best thread to drag back up. I know myself better than anyone, and I have absolutely no idea how I didn't respond to any of those comments.

Well, I'm pretty sure everyone can stay focused on the Small Business Server part of all this. I mean, this was a long time ago.

JamesNT

What was the prediction? I think more people are on cloud than ever before, but not all of them stuck with Microsoft. Microsoft (probably unintentionally) opened themselves up to real competition in enterprise markets that they previously dominated. AWS vs. Azure, Google Apps vs Office 365. They made people feel comfortable moving their data to the cloud.

Thanks to more aggressive competition and new players in the cloud space (Google Apps for Business, etc.). Prices are way down across the board for basic cloud services. I'd say they're probably at their lowest during this adoption phase where companies are trying to maximize their user base.

For a 5 user office, you can get the same features of SBS standard in the cloud without any additional cost by using the new Office 365 Business Essentials plan. A static IP runs you about $25-30 a month for most ISP's. 5 Users with 365 Essentials is the same price as that and you get all the same stuff (Exchange, SharePoint/OneDrive, and a bonus: Lync/Skype). Server 2012R2 Essentials and 2016 integrate nicely with 365. You don't need a static IP anymore so the cost basically cancels out.

For the 25-75 User (SMB) range, they also see the benefits of reduced pricing with cloud services, but it's still significant. They're pretty used to it by now though. Implementing their own VoIP systems because their seat count is too high. What's another VM? Microsoft is also raising prices for this SMB segment by now requiring core licenses for even Windows Server Standard edition. Luckily workloads that need more than 16 physical cores remain at the upper range of that user limit. Though this mainly affects their largest customers who would use quad processor boards with a single license of Datacenter. It's still not at a point where the SMB market would consider switching platforms. Larger enterprises may have made the move already.

Bottom line: The good news is that the micro/small businesses are enjoying price stability as mentioned above. The bad news is that the SMB segment is continually seeing increasing prices/management costs. They're not getting additional value for their investment.

IaaS still remains a premium service.