Home Forums Feedback on Windows 8 and touch screens with AC

Just looking for some advice on what sorts of new machines to upgrade to. I have 5 to 6 yr old PC's all running Windows XP, in a server-client arrangement in a small office. I have good on-call IT support when I really need it but we're a small practice and I can do most things myself. It's time to upgrade most of my client machines in patient rooms and at the nurse's station and instead of trying to put in new hard drives and upgrade RAM, etc in order to try and save a few hundred dollars (as some on these boards have indicated they are doing), I'm going to spend a few thousand dollars and buy new. I have 9 machines to upgrade and plan to do 3 or 4 a month until I'm done.

I'm not thrilled about Windows 8, mainly due to the confusing interface. I've read other threads here suggesting that the newest version DOES boot to the desktop, which would be a big improvement for me. True?

Also, anyone care to comment on whether you've used the Windows 8 touchscreen functionality with Amazing Charts? Is it useable and/or worth it? It would be a lot cheaper to keep my current monitors and just buy the new towers, letting the touch screen thing go. I have a brand-new upgraded server and all I will be using these new machines for is as clients to pull down from the database on my server. So I don't need anything more than the basics if I buy new. Or perhaps I should just have someone build new machines to spec and install Windows 7 instead?

Thanks a lot for any insights you folks care to offer.

Jim

Jim,

I would buy from the hardware vendor of your choice (HP, Dell, Lenovo) and get machines with the W8Pro license so that you (or they) can upgrade them to Windows 7 Pro. Many vendors have experiences such hate for W8 that they are shipping new machines already upgraded to Windows 7.

I can point you to the Dell/HP/Lenovo Scratch & Dent outlets, if that is your thing.

AC doesn't support touch/multi-touch so that would be a waste of your time/$$$ if AC is their primary use.

As Jim[mie] has pointed out elsewhere, another portable and cost-effective solution is ChromeBooks or ChromeBoxes.

Jim,

I'm the cheap black sheep here, and I love Win 8.1 Pro. I am not a fan boy for Microsoft. Yes, you can boot to the desktop.

My hospital had a difficult time connecting me into their clinical databank, but they figured it out after 1-2 hours. Primarily since they had not dealt with Win8 before. Check with your hospital IT if that's an issue for you. It has something to do with the new version of internet explorer possibly not being supported on their systems yet I believe.

Win8.1Pro is Win7Pro with a normal desktop you need, plus a Metro interface for touchscreens you will not need.
Win8.1Pro is Win7Pro with better security.
Win8.1Pro is Win7Pro at half the price.
Win8.1Pro is Win7Pro without the start button. You can add it with free add-ons (start8 or classicshell), that we don't use.
Win8.1Pro is Win7Pro but faster. I'm biased
Win8.1Pro is Win7Pro with a different way to turn it off or restart it, in the right instead of left lower corner.
Win8.1Pro is Win7Pro but with a probably cheaper upgrade path to Win9Pro in about a year.

Win7Pro with AC was the worst experience with computers in my career.

I bought 5 new HP Win8 "down"graded to Win7 machines for my exam rooms 1 year ago. It was hell with AC only. AC kept crashing when I came in the room to log in on almost every patient. Nobody here had any issues and guardian support at AC had never heard of it. When Win8.1 came out last October, I bought new machines for the exam rooms, upgraded everything to Win8.1Pro, and haven't had an ounce of trouble with the machines, or with AC, or with my staff about Win 8.1Pro.

I suggest that you watch some youtube videos on Win8 navigation and searching, because it is different and smart doctor types don't like to feel stupid. To boot to desktop you right click on the taskbar in the desktop, go to the navigation tab, and check the two top check boxes in the Start section, and go to work. I haven't seen any employee trying to explore Metro land, even though I told them that they were welcome to explore. If they do and get lost, just push the Windows key and the D key together and they will go back to the safety of the desktop.

I suggest that you buy a Win8.1Pro box and play with it for a while before you decide. You can always downgrade it.

I gave a 2 page letter to the staff about working in Win8.1, how to open and close it, how to get back to the desktop if they get lost in touchscreen metro land, listings for youtube videos, and I haven't had any complaints. They figure it out quickly and it becomes routine.

Interesting. Most people have had the opposite experience. In fact, HP has had to bring back Windows 7 "by popular demand".

The only problem I have with Windows 8/8.1 is that you cannot roll back Internet Explorer. Some hospital portals just barely started support IE9 (out since 2011). We tried multiple workarounds including developer options and registry changes but they were futile.

I would make sure that everything you use works/works well with Windows 8 before moving.

They also removed XP Mode from Windows 8. But they added a few things like Client Hyper-V and Bitlocker Disk Encryption (previously only available on ultimate/enterprise versions). Throw on something like classic shell or Start8 and the interface is virtually identical to Windows 7.

Also one thing that often gets overlooked is all the peripherals (printers, scanners, etc.) that won't have 64 bit drivers when upgrading from Windows XP. Check your printers for support for Windows 7/8. We've been mainly selling Windows 7 32-bit machines here since it tends to be compatible with older printers and scanners. Windows 7 32 bit or Windows 8.1 64 bit are our biggest sellers.

I know some people are still installing just OEM versions of Windows 7, but the downgrade method is the best approach since you can always go back up to Windows 8.

I think it was going to 64 bit machines that did it, and my uneducated guess is that Win8.1Pro handles 32 bit applications better on 64 bit machines than Win7. My only other programs were on Access runtime. Maybe a Win7 installation problem on that day at the plant. Remember not wanting a car made in Detroit on a Monday? Anyway, I was desperate to get away from Win7/AC, and it worked out great for me.

The change from Windows to Mac, or between Android and iOS, is 10x larger than changing from 7 to 8.1, with the boot to desktop. I grant you that if you are new to Win8 you can feel that same helpless feeling that came from learning where Macs hide everything, but that really is just a problem for the administrator that has to set up the machines. And by the second or third machine, it is routine. Windows key and the X key together is my friend.

My employees log in like they did before, double click on an icon placed on one of their favorite pictures like they did before, and go to work like they always did. The only difference is that it turns off a different way, and that can be the same with start8 or classic shell. It's funny how I never had to show any of the employees how to put a picture of their kids or pets on their Win8.1 desktop. Metro is just this useless appendage for office based work with keyboards and mice, but it's out of the way, hidden behind the left lower corner. I would delete it if I could, but it is as harmless as an application that you no longer use, just taking up hard drive space.

If there was no price difference, I probably wouldn't have posted on this thread.

Windows 7 Pro and Windows 8 Pro cost the same.

Sandeep, this is what I found in October

Win 7 Pro upgrade
$249 was the price back in October
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Win...17&sr=8-3&keywords=win+7+upgrade
http://shopper.cnet.com/windows/microsoft-windows-7-professional/4014-3672_9-33715503.html

Win8 Pro upgrade
$95 is what I paid
http://www.amazon.com/Microsoft-Win...mp;sr=1-1&keywords=win+8+pro+upgrade

been using win pro 8.1 on my surface pro 2 without a hiccup unless you consider using the capacitance pen an issue since AC not written for touch screen/gesture technology and some of the tabs are small; would like to be able to expand the view and only use my fingers.
Use the metro interface, removed those tiles I never use and replaced them with tiles for AC, quest, hospital information systems and once chosen they get brought up on the desktop anyway, haven't had problems with latest Internet Explorer in past got around it by using compatibility mode when a website connection issue came up.
just my 2 cents

Just to make sure the non-computer types around here aren't confused by the snark, removing Windows 8.x and installing Windows 7 is a DOWNGRADE, not an upgrade.

In accordance with Microsoft licensing, when you purchase a copy of the latest version of Windows, you may downgrade to the earliest supported version. Therefore, Windows 8.x users may downgrade all the way down to Windows Vista Service Pack 2 as of this writing.

I'm also noticing that experienced and highly technical forum members are spending more time complaining about Windows 8.x rather than doing what they did with Windows 7 which was learn how to use the OS so they can help others. It may be time to step up rather than burn all that hard earned political and trust capital acquired over the years. Windows 8.x is here and people want/need solutions.

JamesNT

And in regards to HP bringing back Windows 7 by popular demand, please try to not be taken on by clever marketing.

http://www.zdnet.com/hp-bringing-back-windows-7-pcs-not-so-fast-7000025351/

JamesNT

I think this view is misinformed. The majority are saying it's basically Windows 7 when you install something like Start8 or Classic Shell. The major issue for many practices is that you cannot roll back the version of Internet Explorer included with Windows 8. Other than that it's pretty much identical.

All of our computers are running Windows 8.1 Pro with Start8 here and it's more or less the same.

Let's keep it real about the marketing too. Windows 7 Usage and sales far surpass Windows 8. Windows 8 Usage & Adoption is probably less than 10% and Windows 7 is probably closer to 50%. Just a few months ago, Windows 7 increase in market share was higher than Windows 8. No one said they stopped selling Windows 7. They are just focusing their efforts more on selling PC's with Windows 7. It's working for Dell and Lenovo. The author assumed "brought back" means that they stopped selling Windows 7 in the first place rather than they stopped advertising it. How many retail outlets still have Window 7 models on display?

I remember when Windows 2000 first came out. The first thing I saw was IT Pros and end users crying from on-high that Microsoft would have to pry their precious Windows 98/NT from their cold dying hands. By the time Windows XP/Server 2003 came out, companies were still running Windows NT Server and had Windows NT based domains. And there were plenty of Windows 98/NT Workstations still in use. It wasn't until Windows XP Service Pack 2 came out that people finally got serious about leaving Windows 98/NT. Sonoco, one of my previous employers, reportedly turned off their last Windows NT 4.0 Server sometime in 2004 based on what a friend told me.

I remember when Windows Vista first came out. The first thing I saw was IT Pros and end users crying from on-high that Microsoft would have to pry their precious Windows XP from their cold dying hands. By the time Windows 7/Server 2008 R2 came out, companies were still running Windows XP/Server 2003 and had Windows Server 2003 based domains. And there were plenty of Windows XP workstations still in use. It wasn't until Windows 7 Service Pack 1 came out that people finally started getting serious about leaving Windows XP/Server 2003.

There is most certainly a pattern, here. And even for a year or more after the release of Windows 2000, you could still by a brand new server from Compaq pre-installed with Windows NT. Just like today you can still buy a server pre-installed with Windows Server 2008 R2 from Dell.

HP, again, is just cashing in on the marketing. The rules have been this way since the 90's. Microsoft is well aware that companies have to invest in training and that applications must be tested before anyone will move. Windows 7 is now the current OS on the market and Windows 8 is the new guy. With half of users on Windows 7, for a big company like Sonoco or Guilford Mills they'll just finish out their Windows 7 deployments and totally ignore Windows 8. Upgrades to Windows Server 2012 will continue, of course, so companies can take advantage of very generous licensing models for virtualization and clustering. If you look at the sales numbers of Windows 2000 Workstations versus Windows XP versus Windows Vista versus Windows 7 versus Windows 8 you'll see similar uptake patterns in adoption.

Microsoft is the only software company that offers 10 years of support for its various products that I am aware of. The question really isn't the adoption of Windows 8 since what we are seeing is nothing new at all. Rather, the question is with this new rapid release cadence MS has going on how will customers react when there is a new OS every other year as opposed to every 5 years.

Interesting article:

http://www.zdnet.com/windows-8-is-the-new-xp-7000006095/



JamesNT

Thank you all for the helpful information and opinions.

Jim

Microsoft seems to push the envelope with every other version. These versions are often not quite finished and do indeed push new changes
Win 98 to 2000 (I will ignore ME version, everyone else did) (Nothing really wrong with 2000 but many places skipped from 98 to XP) But who really needs an NT core and possible 64 bit processing?
Win 2000 to XP: despite the above article, it seemed to go smoother.
XP to Vista (or was that Beta Win 7?) Networking really needed fine tuning, and it required more memory before the price had come down.
Long release beta cycle for Win 7 and it became very popular and the standard
Then to Win 8 (You really need a start screen not a button...) The underpinnings go back to Vista though.
All in all, a gradual progression. Win 8 is a pig without the pretty pen, add Classic Start and now you can wallow back in the mud. Ah, heaven. Apps may be a plus, that remains to be seen.