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Anyone know how the merger of AC with Pri-med will affect us as users? think it will be good thing for us or will it be tougher? thik the pricing will change?
just wonder how all of it may affect us and thoughts out there!
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Bob
Allergy
Mansfield, OH
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Where am I going and why am I in this handbasket?
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I think it will allow the infusion of cash needed to move AC to the next level.
AC is split in several different directions. They need to jump to the ever expanding MU standards, they are developing a web based model, they are fine tuning System 7, they need to get compliant with Windows 8 (requiring new compliance with a later versions of SQL and Msft Netframework) and they need to keep it affordable.
I see Pri-Med as potentially having the ability to infuse capital as well as provide a venue for training at their various meetings. This is NOT through any inside information but rather only how I view the situation.
How will it affect pricing? Now that's a good question. I suspect that Jon will continue to have input and keep it affordable.
Wendell
Pediatrician in Chicago
The patient's expectation is that you have all the answers, sometimes they just don't like the answer you have for them
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EDIT:
We just got an email! So the below does not totally apply!
ORIGINAL:
Would have been nice to have received an email on this, rather than finding out on this board at 5 PM on Friday......
Generally most Friday PM news releases are timed that way to bury the information....
Gene
Gene Nallin MD solo family practice with one PA Cumberland, Md
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Would have been nice to have received an email on this, rather than finding out on this board at 5 PM on Friday......
Generally most Friday PM news releases are timed that way to bury the information....
Gene I seriously doubt he is trying to bury anything. You are jaded by the political season. I think all of us have been frustrated by the pace of improvement lately and this should be a good thing. Of course, there are ALWAYS unintended consequences. I worry about losing the small, family atmosphere we have around here but, alas, AC may have already grown beyond that. I hope Jon will stay intimately involved. As long as he does, I think this will be a good thing. Time will tell. Change is inevitable. BTW, I did get an email announcing this. I hope you did, too.
Bill Leeson, M.D.
Solo Family Medicine
Santa Fe, NM
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Pri-Med website: "Pri-Med acquires Amazing Charts" http://www.pri-med.com/pmo/Home.aspx
Gene Nallin MD solo family practice with one PA Cumberland, Md
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Hold on, does this mean I can get CME credits from using AC for patient encounters? Awesome!
John
Internal Medicine
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Bob
Allergy
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Looks good to me. Watch the video.....acquisition or partnership? Depends on the spin. Both companies have helped me survive the ....I guess I'd call it....war on my profession. I bet it will make cme less cumbersome,more valuable. I'm happy. Oh and I finally got my MU money...not just the attestation but the actual cash. Maybe it will help me not fall off the impending cliff.
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Interesting.
I am most concerned about the customer service angle.
One of the best parts of AC imho is the service.
Pri-med is free and doc friendly, but it is has a herd mentality to dealing with us
as docs. The company itself is hidden away and inaccessible. Their customer service has an "In your face" attitude. If you need something out of the ordinary-you're screwed.
Hope that doesn't seep over
PS After just attending a Pri-med, I had a a sense that there is a big of looking down noses at "GPs" as many of the internists referred to us.
Vicki Roberts, MD
Family Medicine of Southeast Missouri
Sikeston, MO
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I don't know. I like the idea of Pri-Med and AC working together, as I think any other partnership Jon might have gone with would likely have radically changed the face of AC and the company's path of being for us docs more than for the bucks. Pri-Med has never been a company that seemed to chase our dollars either and I'm hoping the focus on education will help promote AC as that kind of tool more than just a new source of revenue for them. Of course, this being a capitalist market, we have to except some other benefit for the Pri-Med guys too, but I can still hope ... *fingers crossed*. At least Jon's brainchild wasn't bought out by one of the bigger EMR companies that just wants to bleed us dry. Having been a cheerleader for this company since the outset, I'd have been really bummed if it had gone that way. Now I just want to know if Version 7's tweaks will stay on track and not be derailed by the new announcement.
Shankar Santhanam
Family Med
Lawrenceville, NJ
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I don't know. I like the idea of Pri-Med and AC working together, as I think any other partnership Jon might have gone with would likely have radically changed the face of AC and the company's path of being for us docs more than for the bucks. Pri-Med has never been a company that seemed to chase our dollars either and I'm hoping the focus on education will help promote AC as that kind of tool more than just a new source of revenue for them. Of course, this being a capitalist market, we have to except some other benefit for the Pri-Med guys too, but I can still hope ... *fingers crossed*. At least Jon's brainchild wasn't bought out by one of the bigger EMR companies that just wants to bleed us dry. Having been a cheerleader for this company since the outset, I'd have been really bummed if it had gone that way. Now I just want to know if Version 7's tweaks will stay on track and not be derailed by the new announcement.
Shankar Santhanam
Family Med
Lawrenceville, NJ Totally agree-so glad that we weren't sucked up into some other company.
Vicki Roberts, MD
Family Medicine of Southeast Missouri
Sikeston, MO
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I am a bit naive in all this stuff, but since going with AC a year ago, has been the single best business move I have made in 20 years. I have entrusted my livelihood to AC and have been anything but disappointed, in fact am having more fun than ever doing the grunt work every day.
So, I am trusting Jon on this one as well.
jimmie
internal medicine
gab.com/jimmievanagon
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IMHO, this will be fine. At least for a moderate practice horizon.
However, this does push my independence button. Like everyone here, we made the decision to hitch our wagons to the AC mule. I think it behooves us all to have a fallback plan, in this just like everything else we do. It might be well to periodically ask ourselves just how vital is this MU money? Could we not just keep going without upgrades and the moving target of EMR certification requirements?
David Grauman MD
Department of Medicine
Commonwealth Health Center
Saipan, Northern Mariana Islands
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So, I'm not the doctoring sort, but I know a fair amount about M&A (mergers and acquisitions), as I've been on both sides of them many times.
On the buyee side, they take the money and the buyer because of what that means to them and the future of the company.
On the buyer side, they render up millions (typically) and for that they expect an X times return on that money over 1-2 business cycles (perhaps a bit longer), or a higher multiple over a longer window.
There is nothing wrong with either side's motivation, but for the activity to be successful, it is important that each side perform.
For AC, this will probably mean becoming more focused on a much-smaller to-do list, and making the most of the cash infusion they get. There will be a much higher expectation that they perform to schedule, and hopefully execute well.
For PRI-MED, they will need to learn from AC how they do the things they do well, and figure out where they need help. They then need to get, give, or supply help and resources in key places.
One of the key places that the AC community can help is in providing the client viewpoint on what is working well, and what needs work. PRI-MED, if they are smart, are going to want to cross-check what AC priorities are, what client priorities are, and what prospect priorities might be to figure out where the efforts should be focused.
As Wendell, James, and several others have observed, AC is spread thin, doing too many things to do them well and in a timely fashion. There is a finite limit to how many people you can put on a project, but one thing you can do is narrow your focus until you get up to speed and begin to demonstrate a repeatable pattern of quality on-time deliveries.
The other thing that the community can do is be clear about what PRI-MED could do that would kill the Golden Goose - Doctors stop recommending AC.
This sounds like a far more favorable M&A activity than some I have seen, but it is inevitable that some things will change. This is a smart, articulate community that can make a significant contribution to the changes to come.
Hopefully this will prove to be holistically beneficial to the new company and the community.
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I agree. I'm at PriMed Boston this weekend and have been favorably impressed by the commitment to patient care while helping providers navigate an increasingly dysfunctional system without quitting or going insane.
AC is at the point where it either has to grow or die. Jon is adapting by becoming part of a multidisciplinary team that includes evidence based medicine, tech / IT, good business and economic sense, medical education and good old fashioned Marcus Welby style patient care. If it's done right it's possible that we can feel like we made a difference in our patient's lives without sacrificing our own .
PriMed and AC make a powerful team. Indy's remote server/cloud work is up and running in my practice; it's a work in progress what with crashing networks and incompatible hardware, but it certainly is keeping me from quitting in disgust and opening a cat shelter instead!!
Way to go Jon- I'm happy for you and look forward to the next step!!
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I agree. I'm at PriMed Boston this weekend and have been favorably impressed by the commitment to patient care while helping providers navigate an increasingly dysfunctional system without quitting or going insane.
AC is at the point where it either has to grow or die. Jon is adapting by becoming part of a multidisciplinary team that includes evidence based medicine, tech / IT, good business and economic sense, medical education and good old fashioned Marcus Welby style patient care. If it's done right it's possible that we can feel like we made a difference in our patient's lives without sacrificing our own .
PriMed and AC make a powerful team. Indy's remote server/cloud work is up and running in my practice; it's a work in progress what with crashing networks and incompatible hardware, but it certainly is keeping me from quitting in disgust and opening a cat shelter instead!!
Way to go Jon- I'm happy for you and look forward to the next step!!
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Indy,
Very well stated. Thanks for that thoughtful response.
Gene
Gene Nallin MD solo family practice with one PA Cumberland, Md
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I do hope this works out for AC and for us users of it. AC has definitely been going through growing pains, especially with the demands of meaningless use and before that chitt-certification, in addition to responding to requests for improvement from the user base (Like V7).
Indy stole much of my opinion up there. AC may well be put under pressure to provide "X" dollars per quarter to its new parent. If it doesn't make it, bad things will occur. But bad things can occur from it trying to make those numbers. There may be additional price increases.
There are potential windfalls also, for it the new parent can help provide AC resources so that it can make its improvements that much faster, it will be a boon to us all.
Wayne
New York, NY
Hey, look! A Bandwagon! Let's jump on!
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I am very happy for Jon and AC .... but I must admit my initial visceral response was to feel a bit like the bridemaid at the wedding ... I had hoped in some way that AC would have further distinguished itself from its competitors by becoming a physician owned product in a much broader sense ... e.g. raising capital by offering non voting stock etc to physician users. But again if it had to be some other set of investors or investor, PriMed seems a very good fit. Congrats.
Gino
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Interesting news. I wish Jon and everyone at AC well as they move forward. I am concerned about Pri-Med and also about their parent company, Diversified Communications. A division of DC just acquired Pri-Med last November, 2011. So it's "dog eat dog eat dog." http://www.expoweb.com/article/diversified-business-communications-acquires-pri-med#.UKlku0KUCLE Pri-Med seems as much about marketing products to docs as it does about CME. I have never attended a Pri-Med meeting--I would rather pay for CME that is free of the heavy taint of the drug companies. I found the following info on AC's website: Q. What can Amazing Charts bring to Pri-Med?
Physician level needs assessment ? Amazing Charts will give Pri-Med the ability to deliver individualized continuing education that is based on practice patterns identified through information users provide from their EHR.
Point of Care ? In addition to its live meetings and online CME courses, Pri-Med will now be able to provide education and information support to clinicians and patients at the point of care during a visit. The best way to do that is through an EHR system.
Practice relationships ? Amazing Charts allows Pri-Med to broaden and deepen CME offerings based on de-identified patient and practice data gleaned from an EHR. So, it sounds like AC will be providing "de-identified patient and practice data gleaned from an EHR" to Pri-Med. The purpose of this appears to be so that Pri-Med can "provide education and information support to clinicians and patients at the point of care during a visit." Sounds like marketing to me. I would be very concerned if AC becomes a marketing tool. This sounds suspiciously like the route Practice Fusion took. As a physician I feel it is very important that we insulate ourselves (as much as possible) from undue marketing influence. Our focus should be on care of the patient and on doing what is best for the patient--not the drug companies and others. Perhaps I am naive to think that anything in medicine is free of marketing but I don't allow drug reps in my office and would not want them paying to influence my EMR. What do others think about this?
John Howland, M.D.
Family doc, Massachusetts
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"de-identified patient and practice data gleaned from an EHR" I suspect this is the same thing that CMS is doing with the data collected from the EHR attestation reports, probably to be used for new "quality measures' (i.e., ways to underpay us).
John
Internal Medicine
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I found the following info on AC's website: Q. What can Amazing Charts bring to Pri-Med?
Physician level needs assessment ? Amazing Charts will give Pri-Med the ability to deliver individualized continuing education that is based on practice patterns identified through information users provide from their EHR.
Point of Care ? In addition to its live meetings and online CME courses, Pri-Med will now be able to provide education and information support to clinicians and patients at the point of care during a visit. The best way to do that is through an EHR system.
Practice relationships ? Amazing Charts allows Pri-Med to broaden and deepen CME offerings based on de-identified patient and practice data gleaned from an EHR. So, it sounds like AC will be providing "de-identified patient and practice data gleaned from an EHR" to Pri-Med. The purpose of this appears to be so that Pri-Med can "provide education and information support to clinicians and patients at the point of care during a visit." Sounds like marketing to me. I would be very concerned if AC becomes a marketing tool. This sounds suspiciously like the route Practice Fusion took. As a physician I feel it is very important that we insulate ourselves (as much as possible) from undue marketing influence. Our focus should be on care of the patient and on doing what is best for the patient--not the drug companies and others. Perhaps I am naive to think that anything in medicine is free of marketing but I don't allow drug reps in my office and would not want them paying to influence my EMR. What do others think about this? It remains to be seen what comes about, but I remember back in the day when certain enterprise software companies started having their software "phone home" and pass along data. Network security folks saw this traffic, deemed it a security risk, and thus began the securing of outbound traffic. So, should this happen, I suspect that we will have a brisk business blocking that outbound traffic for practices. In classic Spy vs. Spy fashion, lawyers can try to change the use license to allow them to "send the data home", and then Doctors can counter with refusing the changed use license and any related 'upgrades'. AC would be wise to actively engage their clients in a straightforward fashion before they might try such things. This community is not the sort to be treated like sheep.
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Interesting news. I wish Jon and everyone at AC well as they move forward. I am concerned about Pri-Med and also about their parent company, Diversified Communications. A division of DC just acquired Pri-Med last November, 2011. So it's "dog eat dog eat dog." http://www.expoweb.com/article/diversified-business-communications-acquires-pri-med#.UKlku0KUCLE Pri-Med seems as much about marketing products to docs as it does about CME. I have never attended a Pri-Med meeting--I would rather pay for CME that is free of the heavy taint of the drug companies. I found the following info on AC's website: Q. What can Amazing Charts bring to Pri-Med?
Physician level needs assessment ? Amazing Charts will give Pri-Med the ability to deliver individualized continuing education that is based on practice patterns identified through information users provide from their EHR.
Point of Care ? In addition to its live meetings and online CME courses, Pri-Med will now be able to provide education and information support to clinicians and patients at the point of care during a visit. The best way to do that is through an EHR system.
Practice relationships ? Amazing Charts allows Pri-Med to broaden and deepen CME offerings based on de-identified patient and practice data gleaned from an EHR. So, it sounds like AC will be providing "de-identified patient and practice data gleaned from an EHR" to Pri-Med. The purpose of this appears to be so that Pri-Med can "provide education and information support to clinicians and patients at the point of care during a visit." Sounds like marketing to me. I would be very concerned if AC becomes a marketing tool. This sounds suspiciously like the route Practice Fusion took. As a physician I feel it is very important that we insulate ourselves (as much as possible) from undue marketing influence. Our focus should be on care of the patient and on doing what is best for the patient--not the drug companies and others. Perhaps I am naive to think that anything in medicine is free of marketing but I don't allow drug reps in my office and would not want them paying to influence my EMR. What do others think about this? Hello, You bring up a very worrisome aspect of this merger. As with most of us who use AC, I have to be very frugal. I have to get CME anyway I can. I wish I could be a purist, but my budget doesn't include CME time or money. I do not mind talking with drug reps to get samples that can help my patients-esp my insulin dep diabetics in the donut hole. The patient assist programs often take about 6 weeks to kick in and the "very simple paperwork" is usually so complicated that many patients cannot negotiate the maze. So we use samples until the patient assist meds can arrive. I don't like the idea of my EMR being a marketing tool for PHARMA. I am also very concerned about EMR going entirely into the cloud and becoming unaffordable for what it provides. The new cloud version is very appealing, but out of my price range. There may not be a concern about the folks on the edge holding on. AC has allowed us to provide quality care to our patients. It will be very interesting to see how this plays out. PS AFter I reread the above I was reminded of the PHREESIA registration program that was "free" at first. It was free because it showed ads to be patients. We tried it for a while and for our practice it was a NIGHTMARE. My seniors couldn't negotiate the tablets and many patients didn't have the literacy skills to get through the screens. The concept was appealing but, in practice turned out to use more staff time and effort than our previous check in program. We were never so glad as when those horrible tablet went back to the company. In other more metropolitan areas with higher SES and literacy skills, it would be great.
Vicki Roberts, MD
Family Medicine of Southeast Missouri
Sikeston, MO
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There is so much I'd like to say. I think we should all just step back and take some slow deep breaths. Nobody is getting any of my patient info whether identified or deidentified without my patients consent. I do not see this partnership changing the fiduciary relationship that I have always maintained with my patients. What good is AC to primed if we all suddenly become disgruntled and walk. Why do we even think about being pushed around. This is our profession. Without our profession healthcare is headed down the drain. Does anyone really doubt that? Jon is helping us to stay in the driver's seat and if primed violates that then they lose big time. So you guys think this is all about stamping out the last vestige of our honored profession? Who but us can stand up to government, industry, wall street data crunchers, administrators and the like. But we need our own data. Maybe now we can put it together. Maybe it will support industry data....maybe not
Nancy
Where's Bert?
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Bert
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Playing the devil's advocate - do people believe your data is not available - the pharma industry has been buying data from pharmacies - unless you opt out they can tell how many PPI scrips, insulin scrips - how many benicar vs diovan, etc. I am not even sure how much is de-identified when patients get letters in the mail advertising diabetic meds and supplies without signing anything.
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No, the sky isn't falling. The DC/Pri-Med acquisition may wind up being a good thing for AC. Time will tell. But I hope that the powers that be will recognize that some, perhaps many, of us will react very negatively to attempts to use AC as a marketing platform or ANY use of patient data, de-identified or not. And, yes, this probably means we will need to pay more for AC. You don't get something for nothing.
AC is terrific EMR software with great customer/tech support. Let's all hope that the acquisition will keep it that way and enable AC to continue to mature and develop.
John Howland, M.D.
Family doc, Massachusetts
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When you e-prescribe diagnostic info is transferred with the scripts already.
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I agree about diagnostic info being sent but ironically the pharmacy software does not utilize it. Pharmacies are audited by the state boards and must have disease states for meds - if you prescribe something off label like metformin then many pharmacies will have inputted diabetes as a disease state (even if you are using for polycystic ovarian syndrome) which will be attached to their pharmacy records. Our local pharmacy had state inspector mad as they were audited and on a few patients they found meds without a disease state attached - told they had to 'fix'. Think it is stupid that it cannot just take diagnoses from our record since I understand diagnoses are attached.
Lots of 'private' information is out there - there is actually a medical bureau which has lots of data and is available for sale. It has been collected by insurance companies for many, many years.....
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Nurses have also been auditing patients charts and establishing databases for years for various government agencies, insurers and other organizations. Maybe it is about time to look at this ourselves in an aggregate way to see what we see as opposed to being told what is seen by others. There is data I'm now tracking in my own office now that I can with ac. We all are aren't we.
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Terrifying move! Not even clear what to do now.
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Sounds like we are at the point where this needs to be hijacked....
so no worries, there is always tequila, limes and Jimmy Buffett....
Todd A. Leslie, D.O.
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Funny thing. Jon and I had just this "what if" discussion at the first ACUC. That time I came away reassured. This time, not so much. But I have seen this coming so I am not really surprised. Don't really even care anymore. I will leave the battles to you youngsters. I am too old and weary and long ago gave up my high ideals about AC being different from all the rest. It was just a matter of time until both Jon and I succumbed to the big dogs.
Leslie
Hospital Employed Physician Who Misses The Old AC
"It's a good thing for a doctor to have prematurely grey hair and itching piles. It makes him appear to know more than he does and gives him an expression of concern which the patient interprets as being on his behalf. "
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It was just a matter of time until both Jon and I succumbed to the big dogs. But it makes a big difference if the dog is a Collie or Pit Bull. It would appear they will let AC continue to grow and develop as in the past (Collie) . The alternative (Pit Bull) is frightening.
Wendell
Pediatrician in Chicago
The patient's expectation is that you have all the answers, sometimes they just don't like the answer you have for them
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I sincerely hope that AC is able to keep the honest and transparent policies that are so great. Imagine some of the other emr's answering my favorite amazing charts faq question: "what are the hidden costs that are going to **** me off later?" Regarding data being shared, years ago I read "A Transparent Society" by David Brin. It completely changed my thinking about privacy, data mining, etc. It's an old book, published in '89, but his ideas are still timely. I know everyone's busy so here's a link if anyone is interested in a brief overview: http://www.davidbrin.com/transparentsociety.html
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 835 Likes: 2 |
Funny I was joking with Jon this past weekend at Pri-Med Boston and the merger didn't even come up.
I share the sentiments of what many have already posted about the merger and just don't know how I will feel about whatever will be the marketing model Pri-Med will introduce into the use of it's software. Suspect it will be something to the effect of industry sponsored CME or advertising popping up into your email box, perhaps aggravating but workable. On the other hand if it pops up as I am in the chart and trying to finish it will be a deal breaker.
By the way I suggest you delete patient email addresses from the registration/patient demographic page in AC now. Not too paranoid am I?
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 73
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 73 |
Well... maybe Pri-Med is a "good fit", and will allow AC to continue on its successful path. But (and there is always one)... what happens when Pri-Med gets acquired by an even bigger company, or when Pri-Med acquires even more niche companies, and then insists on "standardization" across their product lines. Upside... after such acquisition (which may not happen for years), integration into the *big* company "system" will take even more years. So for the "older" docs, probably no worries. But for the younger ones, stay in touch... I've seen this happen in other disciplines... I hope AC can continue their great targeted efforts to this community. (my humble 2 cents)
Happy Thanksgiving to all.
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,546 Likes: 1
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 1,546 Likes: 1 |
Funny thing. Jon and I had just this "what if" discussion at the first ACUC. That time I came away reassured. This time, not so much. But I have seen this coming so I am not really surprised. Don't really even care anymore. I will leave the battles to you youngsters. I am too old and weary and long ago gave up my high ideals about AC being different from all the rest. It was just a matter of time until both Jon and I succumbed to the big dogs. Idealism has a way of falling victim to the ravages of time just like the rest of us. It is so much easier to quantify ones success in terms of money than in terms of "good deeds done."
David Grauman MD
Department of Medicine
Commonwealth Health Center
Saipan, Northern Mariana Islands
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,084
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 2,084 |
what happens when Pri-Med gets acquired by an even bigger company, or when Pri-Med acquires even more niche companies, and then insists on "standardization" across their product lines I think it is almost inevitable that many of the present EHR companies will be absorbed by the larger companies, who all have stockholders to answer to. Just as many of our colleagues practices have been absorbed by for-profit mega-groups, hospitals and insurers. The moment of truth occurs when priorities conflict between customer and board room. Most companies (see the ongoing discussion on Nuance's policies on Dragon Dictate elsewhere on the board) take the low road and screw their customers. Every once in a while there are companies that are successful meeting both goals (Zappos, USAA and Southwest Airlines come to mind). I think that the role Jon B chooses to play, and how long, will be telling.
John
Internal Medicine
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