Home Forums Discussions Problems Moving AC to a new server

Not really a problem but I do not know where else to post. I currently have AC 5.029 running on a windows 20003 sever. I have a new "virtual" server running windows server 2008 and it already has the new version of AC 6.010 and the sql server. Questions:
1. Should I upgrade AC in the old machine before moving the databases?
2. If not, What files do I have to transfer? What is the process that I must follow?

Up to now I have doing the upgrades on the same machine so I never had to move the files. This is what I think needs to happen. Please correct me if I am wrong:

1. Make sure that I have a backup. Or 3.
2. stop / turn off all clients to server
3. start amazing utilities
4. Select detach (and move) databases
5. copy import folder
6. copy illustrations folder (I don't use them but just to be complete and thorough)
7. run database tuner in new server.
After this everything should be fine, correct?
Thanks for your help in advance.

Gerardo,

You are making it way too hard. I would make sure the connection between the old server and the virtual server is disconnected.

1. Install the new version on new server
2. Let it install SQL Server
3. Put in demographics of practice
4. Restore the AmazingCharts.enc file that hopefully you made prior to this.
6. This will put in all patients, settings, license, script writing abilities
7. Run database tuner to make restored file compatible with new database
8. Browse to new server with clients. Reconnect old server if to be used

That should do it. No need to move databases, which is why you may want to delete the .XML file in the old server or rename the AC database.

Good idea!
what about the imported items?
why not use the full version of sql as opposed to use the one ac uses?
Thanks Bert

Just copy them from the old location to the new location in the AC folder.

The old server will be erased and reused as a VM virtual server backup so I do not have to worry about the files. I have also installed a NAS to help with backups.

Perfect. May want to consider leaving it intact for a couple of days until you know you are up and running. What brand NAS?

wow, you answer fast

Many thanks Bert

QNAP USB 3.0. SATA 6Gbp/s Up to 3 GB DDRIII RAM 4-Bay Turbo NAS Tower Server TS-459 ProII with 4 Hitachi Deskstar 3.5 inch 3TB 7200RPM SATA III 6Gbps 64MB Cache Internal Hard Drive 0S03086

Very nice. Probably easier just to show it here.

On #3 on Bert's instructions about putting the demographics, I just put a few elements, this will all be erased when you restore the backup file, you just need a group in place. I usually type random number/letters. Don't need to set up a schedule, again all this will be overwritten.

I do backups/restore's at home periodically both to keep a version handy as well as check that the backups are working.

Good point.

Bert: touch? mon ami! and dang it the price dropped!

Wendell: Thank you!

You didn't pay the $1144 did you?

No, $780.93. I had to pay for shipping, now it is available on prime too

Hello Dr. Carcamo,

I see that you have already installed AC 6.0.10 on the new server.
Here are the steps to follow to move the database over to the new server.

1. On your existing server, run a ?Full Backup?. Meaning you want to open the Backup Utility, click on the Advanced Settings button and make sure Exclude Imported Items and Exclude Images are both Unchecked.

2. Run the backup, when the backup is complete you can find it in the Backup folder that is inside the Amazing Charts folder on the existing server. The backup file will have your practice name followed by some numbers and ending in .enc. Make sure you find the one you just ran. It will have today?s date and the time the backup file was completed.

3. Now you need to get that file over to the new server. You can either browse across the network to find it or place it on a thumb drive and move it over manually.

4. Once you have the backup .enc file on the new server, you will need to restore that backup. Before you do this you need to have started Amazing Charts, created a practice by entering in the practice name, address etc. and created a user account (with the Level Of Access of Highest: Provider) This does not have to be real practice and user information as you will be overwriting it with the restore. You can just click next through the ?add a schedule? part. Also remember the Admin and User passwords, you will need them. Then start Amazing Charts and log in as the user you created. This will attach the database to the SQL Server.

5. Now to restore the backup database you will need to run the Backup Restore Utility. This can be found in the Amazing Charts Directory folder and has a red icon that looks like a ship?s life saver. Run the backup restore utility and brows to the backup .enc file that you moved over from the original server. When you run the utility it may ask you to enter in the Admin password that you created. Once the restore utility has finished, your database has been moved to the new server. Now you just need to run the 6.0.10 database tuner to upgrade the database.

6. If you have any lab interfaces or other interfaces that have placed a folder inside the Amazing Charts Directory folder on the old server, you will need to move those over to Amazing Charts Directory folder on the new server. Then contact the lab company to have them redirect the data they send to you over to the new server.

7. You will need to share out the Amazing Charts Directory folder on the new server giving the Everyone group ?Full Control?. Also if you are running a firewall on the new server, you need to make a port exception to allow port 61067 for both TCP and UDP. If you need help with this we have a video on our website, here is the link http://amazingcharts.com/support/i-want-to-help-myself/video-tutorials/. Just click on the ?Opening Firewall Ports? link.

8. Then un-share the Amazing Charts Directory folder on the old server so none of the local computers can read or write to the old database. When you restart Amazing Charts on the local computers they will make you browse to the new server to connect to the database. Also make sure you reset the path on the old server so it is reading and writing data to the new server. You may even want to disable the SQL Server (AmazingCharts) service on the old server once everything is done. This will avoid any possibility of accidentally adding data to the incorrect database.

I hope this helps you out, if you have any issues with the move please do not hesitate to contact AC technical Support for help.

Thank you,
Anthony@AC

Why didn't I think of that? But that will make for a VERY BIG BACKUP. I currently have about 35 gig in the import folder. I better start now.

Thank you Anthony

Geraldo,

Why didn't you think of what? There is nothing Wendell and I didn't tell you to do. You can back up the imported items or you can move the folder physically. It is a good idea if you have images to include them in the backup. I have never had an issue with copying and pasting the imported items as the links are already contained in the backup. If the backup is local, though, it will be OK if it is contained in the AmazingCharts.enc file.

I am really not sure why I would bother to help anymore. The process by Anthony is identical with the exceptions of a few more details such as how to move your backup, which I would hope is obvious. It is doubtful that Windows won't open port 61067 for you, but if you have problems with connectivity, that would be the first place to look. Unsharing the old AC folder is certainly a great way to ensure there are no errors, but renaming the databases or deleting the .XML file will work as well.

This may sound like sour grapes, but I feel sour, so I will make this statement. I think Anthony could have prefaced his post by stating that it appears you have created your new server. It looks like Bert and Wendell have given you good advice. I agree with their method, but you may wish to consider this as well... or we have found that backing up your imported items is a more foolproof way of moving your imported items. It's kind of like remaking someone else's song. You give credit and you pay royalties.

Bert

I meant no disrespect to either you or Wendell. Both of you gave me great advice, essentially the same as Anthony. The only new information I got from Anthony is what I italicized, which neither you or Wendel mentioned before and it is something I should have thought of myself: adding the imported items and images to the backup.
You said it yourself:Yes, it is now obvious and I should have though of it myself, but I didn't, hence my statement. I do not know if it would make a difference in the long run but it would certainly make it less complicated. I do appreciate your help. In fact, you have no idea how happy I was yesterday, literally jumping on my chair. Alas it turns out I must wait a bit to actually make the switch as my IT expert / cousin wants to make changes to the domain server settings before the move and he is not available this weekend.

So I do apologize. In fact, I have made this small Video of my apology for everyone's enjoyment. Have a great weekend!

Gerado,

No, it is I who should apologize. My post was made directly at Anthony. He made a great post, one that all should read for the topic at hand, but to post it like no one else had solved it was poor etiquette. I am on IT boards where you get called out on that very quickly.

Don't get me wrong. Anthony's reply was better for everyone in that it was very thorough, detailed and even better. I, like you, had never thought of including the imported items and images in the backup you use. While I have done it the other way many times without incident, I must admit I have always been petrified of what would happen if the links no longer worked. (Which is why I make other backups which are not Amazing Charts' backups).

That, in and of itself, makes his post a must read prior to taking on your endeavor. Personally, I will use his method myself.

So, no, I wasn't upset with you. Frankly, I was just being the way too overly-sensitive Bert I always am. But, I did feel very strongly about it.

So, btw, which method did you use and were you successful?

Thank you Bert. I tried to use your method, including Anthony's suggestion to include the imports and images but the backup failed. Bottom line is I ran out of space in my drive. AC is installed in a 200 gig partition with 100 gig free. Part of the problem is AC's redundancy in making the backups (first it makes an pre-tuneup backup [1 gig], then it copies the imported and image folder into one folder [35 gig], then it tries to do the encrypted backup). I can make a backup that does not include the import and images, so I will probably just copy the imported files and images folders manually. Are there any other "essential" folders that need to be moved? I don't care about labs such as quest, I never use them. The only one I really care about is Updox. Do I need to do anything with that?

Another option for if your drive is full is to hook up the new server and "backup AC" to a shared drive on your new server.

Well, there won't be any other files or folders you will need other than the imported items. Given the backup will put all of the links in AC, you should be OK.

A suggestion I would HIGHLY recommend if you are going to do it the way we talked about is two things.

After you copy the imported items folder and images folder and make a back a backup (AmazingCharts.enc of just AC), do NOT delete that set up. As Anthony says, you can unshare it or you can change the name of the AmazingCharts.mdf to .old, and it will not be functional. Then, at least you will have a good working copy until you know you are set on the new server. The last thing you want is to delete that one and find out Imported Items don't work.

Too many people don't do this. But, make a backup (not AC's) of the old AC. Use something like Backup Assist or WIN 7 Pro's imaging backup.

You could also go to Best Buy and purchase an external USB drive. You could get a TB for around $125 and make a backup to it.

If you are worried about the backup, using an external drive makes a lot of sense. Not to be overcautios but you could install the new version to a client, then restore to it to see how it works. Finally, you could get AC support to do it for you. It isn't hard. I don't want to scare you. I can't believe it takes up 100GBs.

You could go to Add/Remove programs and delete programs you don't need. Delete your temp files. I am sure there are many files and programs you could delete.

Thanks for the suggestions. I have already deleted all the superfluous stuff: (temp files, etc). I deleted all the old backups (had some from 2010!) also. I now got about 100 free gig and I am giving another try to the backup with the imported items. Now it is just a matter or pride.

Just an FYI since I do not think I mentioned this in this thread. I recently bought a new dell server and installed vmware. I then virtualized (P2V) my old windows 2003 server (500 gig). During this process I repartitioned the server so it now has only about 300 gig. My plan was to eventually migrate to 2008 so this virtualized server is only temporary, hence the low memory. Of course, i did not anticipate having the issue I am having right now. In hindsight I should have made the data partition larger.

I do not plan to delete / reformat the old physical server right away. It is another backup after all. The virtualized old server (vmware) has also been backed up in its entirety to the recently purchased NAS so worse case scenario I can restore it to its original state as of this morning.

I must say I am a bit confused. Also, didn't you say earlier that you were successful? You can always repartition it. The big issue is even though you can back up to other places, it always backs up to the Backup folder in AC.

Please let me know if you have been successful as I do think I would have a solution.

Backup with imports included failed; unsuccessful. Tried 3 times. with 100 free gigs there should be plenty of space. I'm tired and going to bed. I will not try anymore, easier to just copy the import folder.

You should be able to attach a hard drive (virtual) to the VM. Unless you chose the "allocate all of the disk space now" (non-default) when you created the VM, you should have free space. Or if you shutdown the other 08 VM, you can back it up directly into the 08 VM. The former option is better. Attach a VHD of desired size, back up to it, then detach it and attach into your new VM.

Sandeep,

The problem is, I believe, is the brilliant idea of forcing a backup to the Backup folder inside the AC folder. Therefore, no matter where he chooses to make a backup, he must back up on the old server with the 100GBs of free space (which should be plenty), which means it will back up to the Amazing Charts folder. I have been trying to find a way to keep it from being backed up there.

Gerado, have you checked that folder to see how many old backups are there? Maybe that would free up a lot of space. You can just delete the whole folder. AC will recreate it when it backs up.

Keep in mind that your first thought is very doable. That's another crazy thing about AC. They advise you not to move the databases, yet they have two ways you can do it in the Advanced section of Amazing Utilities. You can also stop the service: SQL Server (AMAZINGCHARTS), but that won't change the imported items.

Just be sure to keep the old one intact until you see that the imported items links work.

O, I get it now. Thanks. So what he's saying is that even with 100 GBs of free space, the backup fails? That's interesting. It could be timing out. Check the event viewer for errors.

Take Bert's initial suggestion of just copying the entire II and images folder. Be sure to make backups.

Bert's comments are right on the mark. No matter how much space I have, and I have PLENTY, AC tries to back up to the folder where AC is installed. There is plenty of space in that partition so I do not know why it failed anyways. I am very busy this week so I plan to defer until the weekend but I just plan move the imported folder manually and save myself a lot of grief. Many Thanks.

Bert, I did delete all the old backups. Thanks.

Also don't forget about your Volume Shadow Copies, one of the most import things on WIN 7 on up. But, they have to be stored somewhere, and they could be stored on your C:\ drive.

You would want them on a different drive. Volume Shadow Copies (a benefit of Volume Shadow Services, VSS) are a powerful redudant backup.

Here are two pictures of them you should check out. Reember, you can't set them up on individual folders only on volumes, hence the term volume. I tend to use it only on my data drive.

Excellent suggestion that Bert made above. Saved me a couple weeks ago when staff member accidentally overwrote a spreadsheet we were working on for a year. Be sure to keep your OS and Data on separate drives or partitions. Even keep AC on a separate partition.

I will look into it, volume shadow copy, thanks. I currently have my data in a different partition than OS but it is my plan to move AC into its own "virtual" dedicated server. Same for my billing software. In fact, that is what I will be doing next. I have to correct some issues with my domain server but it should not take long. Once that is done I will be moving AC to the new server. All good suggestions. Thank you.

Dedicating a virtual server to AC wouldn't be much more efficient than in the host OS with just SQL Express. It's probably only worth it if you have the full version of SQL. It may be even less efficient depending on your current hardware setup.

I have the full sql server available, and David, my IT guy / cousin, wanted to use the full sql server. It was I that put the brakes on that because of advise given by others in this board as well as AC. David did say that with the full sql server he can dedicate more memory than the current version can use, is that the case?

That is true. Depending on the edition, you can usually allocate 4GB or more:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms143685.aspx

The workgroup edition that comes with SBS 2011 Premium Add-on tops out at 4GB.

The SQL Server Standard is 64GB.

The reason I said it might be less efficient would depend on the current hardware of your server. If you have a RAID 1 of 500GB hard drives, that might be too slow for two operating systems.

A way you can maximize the performance and keep AC support is to RAID 1 some SSDs and store the database on there. That'd make it very fast.

Yes, there are reasons Express is free. 2005 is 1GB RAM and 4GB storage. 2008 gives you 10GBs of storage.

Not sure who gave you the advice on not to do it. AC will say that, because they don't support or know how to support it.

No offense, and I don't know how good your IT guy/cousin is, but it isn't simple to make an instance on a different type of SQL. There are those who can, though.

I was trying to get this to work for a while ha. I put it on hold until I learn the best practices. Certain conditions have to be met. I.e. the instance name is AmazingCharts, migrating the usernames and passwords without resetting them (tricky), the port numbers, etc. Upgrading an instance from 32 bit to 32 bit is easy. Making a 64 bit instance from scratch can be a little tough. Though I'm sure it's cake for Bert's friend, Raj.
Another thing. It looks like SQL Workgroup Edition (the one that comes with SBS 2011 Premium) is limited at 4GB in the 64 bit edition too so won't be beneficial over the 32 bit edition. (32 bit to 32 bit is easy)

I'll tell Raja to be on the lookout for you. By the way, I was having issues with my SharePoint backup the other day, so I contacted Justin from EE. $75.00 later, all done. I think you know what I am talking about, but nothing is cooler than watching an expert who is remoted in to your computer just fly through the OS with the mouse while they diagnose and fix it. Sure, no life.

I don't mean just knowing how to fix it; I mean when their mouse is on overdrive, and they aren't missing a click.

It's nice when they know what they are doing. I actually called Microsoft support one time for an issue with Expression Web and corrupt license store, but the support technician was having a difficult time using the tool. (She wasn't used to command line and also quite flirty). I just needed the tool though, I already knew how to use it.

I haven't really called support besides that. The rest is just googling or testing. I have the time (for now at least )