Home Forums Guidance for buying a new server that will grow with us.

Hello,
We have been out of the AC scene for a while with lots of server woes. The good/bad news is that we just got an SBA loan that will allow us to upgrade our computer system. we are still on 6.09 and crashing on almost every encounter.

Currently we have a 32 bit server running SBserver 2003. We would like to keep it as an accessory? Actually I would like to take it outside and find one of my hunter friends to shoot. We run 15 laptops-2 or 3 are hard wired. I would like that to change.

I have very sick patients who get a lot of tests so my imported section is very large. Has anything come up where we can archive some of this to another place beecause that takes so long to load.

I will look back for the older posts I have done regarding server issues because I know we will need help with migration as well.

Thanks in advance to anyone who can and might have the time to help.

I feel terrible for you. I was charged with getting a new server. I have learned that the hardware is the cheap thing...all the licenses, etc and software can cost bucks. A 2k server cost me almost 10k to implement. And that was after getting 3 bids and playing hardball with all of them. Finding a person to help with this is the key. I found a company in South Bend Indiana and they were great (harmony healtchcare). Good luck...make sure not to underesize your server...

Check out this thread:
http://amazingcharts.com/ub/ubbthreads.php/topics/40565/Server_Hardware_Recommendation#Post40565

Do you need Exchange or SharePoint? If you're having that many problems, you may want to start with a fresh install and move your files over.

Also, wire all of your workstations. Get a gigabit switch as well.

We too are looking for a new server for our AC.
The imported items conundrom really has us stymied: it doesn't make any sense why adding items to the II folder should result in such a performance hit (assuming the indices are set up correctly and are intact in SQL): The SQL table stores the record of the item, date, type (and of course patient) and a path to the file itself. The II itself isn't accessed until one clicks on that item in the treeview.
FAP I understand is much faster. I have built a view external to AC on an Access MDB (Access for crying out loud) of similar architecture (paths to the actual PDF or TIF) that as > 250,000 records, and it is MUCH faster that then AC implementation.

OK, enough of that rant, but a seque to my added question:
I am considering a SSD, but don't have the $2500+ for a TB drive. Don't need one if: a) don't use AC II tab, or b) can have the images them selves (PDF and TIF) stored on another DRIVE. Is there such an option?

Vicki,

Unless you are so inclined as to build your own server as Sandeep suggests, you simply can't go wrong with any of the Dell T410 through T710 series. I still recommend the T610, which is the basic equivalent of the the workhorse Dell 2900 Edge.

You could even pick out the hard drives and have them configure the RAID with an SBS 2011 Standard. Of course, RAID isn't that hard to set up with a hardware controller as long as you know how to load the driver. Of course that means not having the server installed.

Contrary to what Sandeep will tell you, if you don't have good IT, I would have someone set up the client/server domain for you.

Building is always fun

If you do choose to build, you'll find out the configuration part is going to be much more time consuming. You may want to get SBS Standard if you have over 25 users and/or need Exchange/SharePoint. If not, go with SBS Essentials. You'll save a lot on CALs and the operating system itself. How many users do you have for those 15 workstations?

Thanks so much Todd. I think that the server that was built for us before may have been planned for obsolescence. I definitely want to educate myself so that I can have room to grow with the server. Thanks so much for your response.

PS Todd, I am afraid of getting taken as well. This is so scary and my knowledge is so limited.

Hi Sandeep,
Thank you so much for your suggestions. I like the idea of hardwiring our stations. The ones that are, are so much faster.

What is a gigabit switch?

We don't use sharepoint or exchange. I would like to utilize them. I want to start with fresh software for the server-will have to use the AC data we already have.

I am so afraid of this process. Thanks for your help.

Hi Nephros,
Thanks for your post and good luck with your adventure to a new server.
Most of your post is way above my head. I am very interested in learning
about FAP because of our problems with imported items.

So much to learn... Thanks

Hi Bert,

I appreciate all the help and suggestions that you all have given .
We had a pro set up our first server and despite all the problems we are
having now, we have had very few true glitches.

I have looked at SBS standard. Is there anything on SBS premium that would be worth paying more?

Hi Sandeep,

We have 8 people using the computer here, plus my husband uses rdc to work from home most of the time.

We googled CALS and got: Client access license or Computer aided logistics support. This is new for us.

So much to learn. We aren't in a big hurry other than waiting the 90 sec to 3 min to get into imported data and hoping it doesn't crash

Thanks for giving us so much help and things to learn!

Don't be afraid, you have the great power of the ACUB behind you

A gigabit switch refers to the speed of the switch. Traditional switches typically have transfer speeds of 100 Megabits or 12.5 Megabytes/Second. Gigabit Switches on the other hand have 10 times the speed which is 1000 Megabits/second (1 Gigabit/second) or 125 Megabytes/second. Let's assume you have a 20 Megabyte video file which you are trying to transfer over the network. That'll take about 2-3 seconds to load off the server on a 100 megabit switch (assuming you are around max speed, which isn't realistic). On a gigabit switch, that would take under 1 second (even at half speed). You said you have 15 computers. With everyone loading and importing items into AC and other folders on the server, you can saturate the network pretty quickly on a 100 megabit switch. A gigabit switch on the other hand would give you 10 times the wiggle room. It really doesn't make sense to not go with gigabit as it's only slightly more than a traditional 100 megabit switch.

For 15 computers, you're probably going to want to get around a 24 port switch. (There's a 16 port version, but that means all the ports would be used. Not much expansion available with that.) There's also a bunch different types of switch Unmanaged, "Smart", and Managed. A fully managed switch isn't really necessary for a small office. An unmanaged or smart switch should be sufficient. (Unmanaged is essentially plug and play. No configuration necessary). Instead of having you do a bunch of research, here are some good switches in my opinion: (I'd probably get the third one since you can enable the managed features if you need them in the future, if not, just plug and play).

Gigabit Unmanaged Switch Good: D-Link DGS-1024D Rackmountable Swit...B Buffer Memory per Device Buffer Memory
Gigabit Unmanaged Switch Premium: Cisco Small Business SR2024CT-NA Un...10/100/1000Mbps ports, 2 Combo SFP ports
Gigabit Smart Switch Premium: Cisco Small Business SLM2024T-NA Gi...+ 2 x RJ-45 Uplink + 2 x Combo mini-GBIC

WiFi is a completely different story. Transfer rates are rarely as high as they advertise. You also get dropped connections as well as higher latency which just leads to a slower experience.

SBS Premium has the full version of SQL which AC doesn't support. It also comes with a copy of Server 2008R2 which you can use as a terminal server. A terminal server is beneficial if you have many remote users and no available workstations or if you have a second office. The great thing about it is that it's an add-on which means you can buy it in the future should you need too. About 200 dollars cheaper than buying Server 2008R2 and SQL 2008R2 Workgroup Edition separately. Nonetheless, I believe SBS Standard should suffice.

CALs are Client Access Licenses which let you use Microsoft Software. You need to have a CAL for each user or each device. Since you have fewer users than computers, it's more economical to license by user. Thus, you need a total of 8 User CALs to be in "good standing" with Microsoft. There's no enforcement to see if you have these CALs, but should you be audited by the Better Business Bureau (BBB), you can face some heavy fines if you don't have these. Just keep track of CALs manually. When you buy SBS 2011 Standard, it comes with 5 User/Device CALs, so you need an additional 3 CALs for the remaining users. These are about 60 dollars/user. You can often get some savings if you buy them in bulk (5, 10, 20, etc.). Here are some examples from a reputable site:

Microsoft Windows Small Business CAL 1 User
Microsoft Windows Small Business CAL 5 User Pack

Remote Web Workplace is included in SBS 2011. It will give you access to each of your workstations. Automatically set up when the SBS Connector is run. No forwarding ports for individual computers.

CAVEAT: If you are going with SBS Standard, make sure all of your workstations are the professional editions of Microsoft's desktop operating system or higher, e.g. Win 7 Professional, Win Vista Business, Win XP Professional or else you're in for a nasty surprise.

If you are going with anything, make sure your workstations are the professional editions.

Not sure about 2011, but with previous versions while there were CALS requires for the clients, there were no CALS required for the clients.

Please get PoE (I will let Sandeep explain this)
Please get Exchange and let Sandeep or our guys or me set up your MX records for SMTP
Please, please, please use SharePoint

SBS Essentials will let you join Win 7/Vista Home Premium to the domain/XP Home to the domain. But you won't get remote access to the home premium workstations.

In SBS Standard, you can't join them to the domain. But as Bert says, it's best to use the professional editions. However, if you have 15 copies of Home Premium, upgrades to Professional will be roughly 75 dollars per computer and that may be too pricey to upgrade.



I'm confused on this one. I believe SBS 2008 Standard/Premium also required user and device CALs. SBS Essentials requires no CALs.

PoE stands for Power over Ethernet. This will let you power devices that support PoE like VoIP phones, network web cams, or IP cameras. Since ethernet cable is considered low voltage wiring, it's often much cheaper to use PoE than having an electrician running outlets everywhere. Also, the wire itself (CAT 5e/6) is often much cheaper than AC wire. It's also great for setting up access points for greater wifi coverage. Bert uses VoIP phones in his office. It's way less clunkier to have 1 ethernet cable going to a phone than separate power bricks or PoE injectors everywhere. It's a nice feature but it's often double the price to get a PoE switch. If you have a few PoE devices or none, it maybe more economical to get a regular switch and PoE injectors. Here's an example of a PoE switch:

Cisco Premium Smart PoE Switch: Cisco Small Business SLM2024PT-NA PoE Gigabit Smart Switch SG200-26P 10/100/1000Mbps 24 x RJ45



SBS's wizard can do this automatically assuming you use one of their suggested domain providers like GoDaddy. (Updates every 5 minutes) If not, you can ask either Bert or I to guide you through the setup.



Check this thread to see the benefits: http://amazingcharts.com/ub/ubbthreads.php/topics/41753/

I know this is a lot of information, but we want you to be fully aware of the cost and complexity involved. We don't want you going in expecting to spend 1,000 dollars and end up spending 20,000 dollars on hardware and IT nor do we want you to waste your time. Being aware of the cost will prevent you from being swindled. Some IT Technicians aren't the fairest when it comes to price (cough GeekSquad).

Vickie, Bert is the FAP expert (and I think developer?)

Nice info on building a server. Look forward to learning lots!

Additional musings to the above information. Some is restating, some is new info

SBS Essentials does not have Sharepoint and Exchange as does SBS Standard. You can buy the Premium upgrade which will give you second server and SQL server standard but it costs more than Essentials.

It does have 25 CALs built in, simplifying the cost and keeping up with them. (I think SBS Standard comes with 5.)

Gigabit internet made more of a speed difference in my system than anything had in a long time. It requires each computer to have a Ethernet connector that a gigabit and a gigabit switch (as above.) Wiring has to meet specs too, but you probably have 5e wiring which will be sufficient.

If you are going to keep the laptops and they are more than 2-3 years old, you might have to get gigabit adapters. Most of the newer ones have gigabit built in. If you are replacing them, there is a thread about desktop vs laptop that is worth reading.

A good IT person will help you choose the options you need and balance the cost.

Thanks Wendell. Really appreciate learning the differences between the SBS packages.

Everyone has been so helpful we really appreciate the information to help us with this process.

Not sure about 11, but 2003 and 2008 were very lax with CALs. You may want to try wit the CALS that come with it and see if you have issues with the others. Of course, it isn't really legal. I'm just sayin'

It's pretty lax too. No enforcement. I thought SBS 2003/Server 2003 was pretty strict with CALs. I remember CAL enforcement on those. Server 2008+ has no CAL enforcement.

Somehow I just don't feel that bad about Bill. But, then again, as a Microsoft Partner, I kinda have to tow the line. Get the licenses free anyway.

Nice.