Home Forums Discussions General Discussion Domain/Workgroup

Hi there. I have had a great experience with AC so far. We will however be expanding our office to include a few outside locations on certain days and I would rather not use LogMeIn but would like to set up computers in these areas to VPN into our network and use the database that is on our server. However the problem I find is that the workgroup computer isn't able to browse to the server and thus cannot find the Database.

I thought I would be tricky and map the folder as a drive on the workgroup computer. However, when I did I received a question asking whether it was the main computer. If I say no it asks me to find the Database again. If I say yes it tells me to install SQL on the laptop.

We are running a Windows Server 2003 server with AC 4.0.45 installed there. The computers in the office have no problems because they are on the domain and have XP Pro. The laptops for this project will have XP Pro as well but I see a problem logging into the domain remotely. Any ideas?

If any of you are free to chat I will be around on some messengers this afternoon. If you are up to giving me some advice in real time just PM me and I will give you my messenger names.

Hi Paul,

I am somewhat confused. When you had your issue, were you using LogMeIn? It sounded as if you didn't want to use it, but then you went on to explain your problem once you logged in.

I do not believe remoting into a client will then allow you to access the database directly. If you are going to use VPN, then you may want to look into getting higher end VPN hardware such as Cisco. You could use a Cisco Easy-VPN-Server-enabled Cisco router or security appliance at the main site, and then deploy smaller Cisco router/firewalls at the remote sites and just set up Easy VPN through the PDM. You can also hire someone with Cisco IT experience. I think Cisco, without a doubt, provides the best solutions for VPN.

Alternatively, you could try

http://www.lockergnome.com/it/2009/...ffices-and-employees-in-just-47-minutes/

although I have never used it. If you did go the Cisco route, and you sprung for a support contract, the support would be able to walk you through everything. I am certainly not a networking guru, but this may give you some ideas.

Thanks for the response Bert! I can use LogMeIn without any trouble but would prefer not to use it as when the people that are servicing the remote areas are at the remote offices their computers are still in use at our office and financially we would rather not buy more machines at the moment.

So, what I would like to do is have the remote laptops with AC installed on them and then, like in our office, use the database file located on the server. The problem is that the laptops are on workgroups instead of on the domain. The reason for this is that you cannot contact the domain to log in without a dedicated VPN such as the Cisco hardware VPN options you mentioned, and the cache that stores the entry saying the log in is "ok" is only good for (I think) 5 logins after the computer cannot communicate with the server.

So, I tried mapping the drive from the server, which worked and I could see the database and select it in Amazing Charts. However, AC would then ask me if the remote computer was the "main" computer. I said no, of course. The window asked me to choose the file again. I did and this time selected that this WAS my "main" computer. I got a message then stating that I needed to have SQL installed.

Without buying something or dedicating computers at the office to LogMeIn I don't know of a way around this. I was hoping someone had done something like this before and could help me figure out how to let AC know that the file was not actually on the remote computer, that the mapped drive was in fact, a network drive. I just know there has to be a way to accomplish this.

Bert, I am not sure I understand the need to use LogMeIn with an Application that runs SQL Server.

SQL Server is an IP Addressable Database, as such the connection string, whether it is ODBC or .Net will include all of the info necessary for the Application to connect to the database.

If you are using VPN you should be fine because you will be "in your subnet" and the SQL Server should be found automatically.

Outside of your firewall, remember SQL Server listens on Port 1433.

George,

Please copy and paste or show me where I recommended LogMeIn as a solution.

What computer is able to see the database? I really don't think you can do this with the way you are trying to set it up unless I am misunderstanding something. Generally, with remote connections such as RDP, RWW, VPN, VNC, Terminal services you can only access the remote desktop and not browse from the remote computer to the database directly. While you can use mapped drives, I am not sure why you wouldn't want to connect directly to the database on the server.

Let me know. I do have an idea if you want to PM.

Bert, I should have addressed GuitarPaul..my apologies!

Not a problem, George. I figured as much.

The remote laptops can see the database files if I map the drive. I cannot browse the the server from the remote laptops though, because they are not on the domain. I would prefer not to use remote desktop or LogMeIn. I would very much love to connect directly to the database on the server but the remote laptops will not allow me to since they are not on the domain.

I am not so sure you can get them on the domain remotely. I have a question. Why are you remoting in and trying to access the database that is mapped on a client? Why not just remote to the server directly?

I'm sorry. I think I keep missing a small detail each time.

Also, when you say "see" the database files. Do you mean, the laptops see the desktop remotely and then, of course, can see the database which is mapped? That would make sense. Of course, then you could run AC from the host desktop. You would also be able to browse to any file that you could browse to if you were on the domain. But, you would not be able to open AC on your laptop, reset the path and then try to browse directly to a database on the server. Even if you could, the Internet speed would not be nearly fast enough to use the database.

I believe what GuitarPaul is referring to is that he can see the database folder with mapped drive but not the database server/ db.

The reason you are having this issue not because the laptop cannot see the database server, but because your laptop workgroup login is being rejected by the sql server.

My suggestion is the following
1. Take the laptop to main office and make it join the domain.
Make sure you use it at main office for a day or so, so that it has the security credentials cached in.
2. Then bring back the laptop to remote location, and you should be able to login with your domain credentials(since the password etc is cached).
3. Then connect using VPN (software VPN should be good)
4. When it asks for databases server give it IP address, since name resolution does not work great on VPN(until you have a high end one).

I can certainly try that. The main thing I was worried about was that the laptop would at some point "lose" those cached credentials and then the person would not be able to log in. I currently have a similar issue in our sleep study department. We have a small workgroup setup over in their department and we do not want to join those computers to the domain because they have cameras and the owners are afraid that someone could potentially view those cameras. However, we want them to be able to use Amazing Charts as well. I wish there is a way to use the database while still being on the workgroup.

SQL Server supports two authentication modes:
1) Windows Authentication - which requires domain credintials to log into the server
2) SQL Server Authentication - which requires a username and password, which are not related to the domain.

Make sure your server is set up to support BOTH Windows & SQL Server Authentication. To do this, open the SQL Server Management Studio, right click on the server in the tree and select "properties"

Then select "Security" and click the "SQL Server and Windows Authentication mode" and save. Restart the Server. You can then assign a username and password and allow that user specific rights for each database.

GuitarPaul: I believe it is 50 logon atatempt is the limit. So if you can bring the laptop once week and login into the main office into the domain, you should be good again. I would periodically keep bringing it back.

gkfahbulleh: AC 4.0 has SQL express with mixed mode security already setup. Also it has some weird security, and I had a tough time getting in( I have worked my entire life with sql server including building the product).

I will try putting it on the domain for a while then and see what kind of results I have.

@gkfahnbulleh: Thanks again for all your help. I am going to see if I can download the Management Studio, as it seems that will be very helpful with administering this SQL server. I don't know where the CD's or documentation are for SQL 2005 so hopefully I can get what I need from ms.com. You saw how the system is set up and hopefully I can get a grasp on SQL enough to straighten it up and get it running as it should be.

EDIT- I downloaded the SQL Management Studio from Microsoft and that enabled me to select the option you mentioned George. I appreciate it and will restart the server tonight and give it a go in the morning.

GuitarPaul, please careful with your db access messing around and you might put your db in a state where you wont be able to access it. SQL server is not like access MDB, and especially sql express is so messy with some protocols and funky security restrictions.

Nephron, SQL Express is exactly like SQL Server. If you run the SQL Server Configuration Manager Tool you will be able to access all of the configuration settings. See the following screen shots.

www.lakepiso.com/servers.jpg

www.lakepiso.com/protocols.jpg

As you can see I am running 4 instances of SQL Server including 2005 and 2008

I am confused as to why AC will not install the DATABASE on to an existing server but rather, will install a new SQL Express Instance. SQL Express does have it's limitations.

Then that is an AC4 issue not a SQL Server Issue. Again, I am confused as to why the program simply does not install the database on the existing server?

the way the sql express is configured when AC installs it is setting up the security so that you just cannot install SQL tools and get in with integrated security.

I know about sql server and sql express(it used to be called MSDE). I worked with the product team( microsoft sql server) about 4 years ago.

The only way you can get in is by changing some accounts(service) and making yourself the dbo.

I would refrain people from messing around with security too much especialy on your main server. There is certian user account the client uses to get into the db. The AC user is not sql server user. I can just go on and on.

Nephron, again, I too have worked with SQL Server from 2000 to 2008, as a DEVELOPER. What is the issue with simply installing the DB on the existing server? I do not see the point of saying AC4 runs on SQL Server but only on SQL Server express.

The very notion of Express is to allow organizations to SCALE UP to the full server edition if they NEED TO.

GuitarPaul,

I thought you may want to take a look at this.

The following link explains step by step how to join the domain using a VPN. It refers to Small Business Server, but the process is the same for standard server versions, however you can ignore steps 14, 15, and 16.

http://www.smallbizserver.net/Default.aspx?tabid=266&ArticleType=ArticleView&ArticleID=83

VPN Configurations:

Server 2003 Configuration:

http://www.lan-2-wan.com/vpns-RRAS-1nic.htm

Windows XP Client Configuration:

http://www.lan-2-wan.com/vpns-XP-Client.htm

You will also have to configure the router to forward the VPN traffic to the server. This is done by enabling on your router VPN or PPTP pass-through, and also forwarding port 1723 traffic to the server's IP. For details as to how to configure the port forwarding, click on the link for your router (assuming it is present) on the following page:
http://www.portforward.com/english/applications/port_forwarding/PPTP/PPTPindex.htm
The only other thing to remember is the subnet you use at the remote office needs to be different than the server end. For example if you are using 192.168.1.x at the office , the remote should be something like 192.168.2.x

Once this is configured you can then use services similar to how you would on the local network. You will not be able to browse the network unless you have a WINS server installed. Also depending on your network configuration you may have problems connecting to devices by name, though this can usually be configured.. Using the IP address is less problematic such as \\192.168.1.111\SharenName.

Taken from Rob W. on Experts-Exchange.