Home Forums Discussions General Discussion Hijacking threads

I got my nose out of joint with Bert on the DDos thread, have had a few days to think about it and have received some great support by email/private messages.

I happen to be more tangential, quite a bit more than others, and will attempt to keep as linear as possible in the future to play along to get along.

I think for the most part that we all treat each other with respect, and because of this the ACUB works quite well. However, sometimes as with any gathering there is a certain amount of "dysfunction" that occurs, and I am not without fault.

I think this user board, and the office of administrator, Global Mod, or Mod or even just a plain old contributor like myself, is bigger than us all.

I also appreciate Bert offering reconciliation immediately after my miffed off post.

Maybe a discussion on the term hijacking is in order and wondering if others had any other thoughts.

Necessity is the mother of invention, and laziness is the mother of delegation. i was worried i might have to have my people talk to your people.

I woulda missed you, and not just cause you're a lazy Updox know-it-all.

Thanks jimmie,

I am very happy to know that you reconsidered. We would certainly miss you had you stopped posting as much. If you recall, I advised you should write a book, meaning your style of prose is something I would like to emulate.

Per your suggestion about talking about hijacking and its various definitions, I found a few helpful sites. Not trying to prove a point, just getting some talking points. I hope it is helpful.

This is a good definition. The cat/dog example is a little week. This is a traditional hijack where it starts because the off topic posts did seem to be on topic.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=thread%20hijacking

This is an example of a forum which takes hijacking very seriously. Experts-Exchange is another one. I belong to many forums like this, which may explain my being a bit more sensitive.

http://en.board.bigpoint.com/skyrama/showthread.php?t=360563

I like some of these because the definitions or comments on hijacking come directly from users of a forum.

http://forums.psychcentral.com/othe...do-not-hijack-other-peoples-threads.html

This one describes the DDoS thread almost to a T, including locking of the thread and control of thread by the author.

http://shmoozezone.com/forum/topic/Thread-hijacking.htm

Dan,

Plato is blamed for the first part, who the second????

Thanks, I think.

Bert,
The calloused index and middle finger tips, Cheetos, 7-up, feet up in reclining chair, and twinkling eyes dancing across the pages of a Harlequin romance novel, reminds me there is a heaven on earth.

I do not know, but I guess a writer would have to have the same discipline my Grandmother displayed with hand quilting. This discipline I lack. But who knows.....

I had no idea hijacking was that complex, and I do appreciate those links. Thanks again.

Thanks. I hope you take them in the spirit it was intended. Just to objectively throw out some ideas to work with.

Wow, is it going to be hard for me to stay out of this thread, lol. Probably should ask everyone to take any of my comments with two grains of salt.

Now, as long as Cheetos were brought up, has anyone have a library full of Cheeto-stained paper backs, as do I? (Sorry, Bert, I could not resist).

That's OK. It's good to have examples.

I should say that I am not talking about some strict rule where the post gets deleted, etc. I think a joke here and there which provides some levity is not a big deal. And, I am not going to be the big bad wolf and jump in and warn everyone.

I certainly don't want a user to sit there with a witty remark trembling and wonder if he/she can post it. Just as long as it doesn't take the thread deep into the woods.

PS I would never delete a post. I may lock it for a few hours, but never move or delete a post. On here, that would be an abuse of power.

I'd be careful about saying never, Bert.
Some contrarian type might try to push the limit.

I can't buy Cheetos, much too habit forming.
One of my secretaries referred to them as orange crack.

Actually, very true. If the post had something vulgar or obscene in it. Or said anything bad about Donna.

Aww, shucks, Bert, that's nice.

So glad everyone is back and happy again!

Well since you asked...

In my opinion such policies should be customized to the particular board in question. This site is different from many others. We seem to have very little of the hostility, ad hominem attacks, and boorish behaviors that are seen on many other boards. There is little limitation on permitted topics for conversation. Although the ACUB is run by the company, users play the dominant role in posting, and to some degree administering it.
The board provides significant value both to users and to the company.

In other words, we have a rather free space to communicate here, and it seems to work well.
This is in spite of very minimal restrictions on posting. Other sites have rather lengthy or complex "codes of conduct". Bert linked some examples above. Currently, the only code here is the one recorded in the board FAQ's: " The Amazing Charts User Board is for users to be able to discuss issues with other users. No anonymous posting are allowed (too much spam and advertisements appear when we allow this). All users must maintain a valid e-mail address. Listing your home page is not required but is encouraged. Play nice. Abusive posters will be banned."

My suggestion is that we maintain this policy without change. Hijacking can be annoying. It can also be entertaining, humorous, or informative. Why don't we let the community-at-large continue to define and practice appropriate behavior? If someone hijacks your post and that annoys you, then you might ignore it and continue to post on-topic. You might also suggest "please let's get back to my topic; start a new thread of your own if you want to continue your discussion". If that request is repeatedly ignored, then that would be considered rude or abusive behavior and the board administrator or moderator could take appropriate action.

" ?All censorships exist to prevent anyone from challenging current conceptions and existing institutions. All progress is initiated by challenging current conceptions, and executed by supplanting existing institutions. Consequently, the first condition of progress is the removal of censorship.?
― George Bernard Shaw

Sometimes I get carried away on issues of perceived or potential censorship; forgive me if I am being a bit melodramatic.

I could not disagree more. Yes, the users play the dominant role in posting, and they should do so responsibly. Censorship implies that there is a higher authority which is unethically restricting people or users from saying things that go against their thinking.

Free speech, free thinking should be encouraged. But, you can have your free speech and still not interfere and be disrespectful of others.

For me, it is simple. The author of a thread deserves to have his thread respected. He or she have a thought or a question. This thought or question does not impede anyone else's ability to post elsewhere. Let's take SandeevP's thread on Problems After SBS 2011 Upgrade, which by the way is a pure thread. He has asked the community if they can help him with HIS problem. He should expect MOST of the posts to be relative to his question.

SandeevP cannot use his AC. CANNOT use his AC. Amazing Charts' support has been unable to help him.

Please understand me. I am not talking about a couple of jokes that stemmed directly from the thread as long as they do not steer the thread in the wrong direction.

But, how would you feel if you asked a question and knowledgeable users posted in hopes of solving the problem and then a hijack completely interrupted. It usually is a tangential post based on something in the previous post. The author says, "This is really killing me. It is almost more than I can bear."

Another user, seeing the word bear, can't resist saying, "Speaking of bears, did you see the game last night? Unbelievable!

Next user: "I know. Who would have thought they would have beaten the Seahawks." (Just making up a game) I would have thought that Jay Cutler's being injured would have been a huge problem.

First user: And, the Seahawks at that. They are the frontrunner for the Superbowl.

Now maybe someone jumps in and says, OK, let's get back on track. I doubt a new user is going to feel comfortable asking two vets to take their football story somewhere else.

Is there a reason other forums have stricter rules? Yes. Because they work. These aren't stuffy, boring rules which cause censorship. Here they are mostly rules which are unsaid, because it is obvious that interrupting the flow of a thread is rude. Now, as you said, our board is different than some. And, some threads are different than others. A great example is Top Posters or What's Up With NewCrop (or whatever the name was). In the Top Posters, it wasn't more than two posts were submitted before all of the other posts were comedic. Probably, because David had said his peace and wasn't looking for sympathy. In the NewCrop talk, that started off very quickly as a bitch/vent session that spiraled down to who was wearing what gown. But, that was OK, because of the type of thread it was and how much steam had gone out of it. In SandeevP's SBS 2011 thread, it is still going strong. His last post, still on topic, was about AC support uploading his databases.

I am not going to delete any post unless it is denigrating or obscene. And, I am certainly not going to go around stating, "OK, boys and girls. Enough of this hijacking."

Policing ourselves so that threads stay on topic is all that we need. I agree we don't need rules to do that. But, posters, mostly new posters, sometimes have to be what hijacking is and why it isn't helpful to do it.

I come on the board at least three times a day. Like everyone else, I scan the MRPs to look for interesting topics. Most of the time they are interesting, educational, helpful and on topic. I rarely see posts that have inertia, are staying true to the topic get hijacked.

I think part of this entire discussion is the strong word hijacked. If you don't know what it is it does sound frightening. I didn't learn the term hijacked on Experts Exchange or UBB Forums or Technet, I learned it right here the hard way.

Another thing that shouldn't be done in forums is posting in the wrong forum. But, that is not something that is ever talked about here. Most of the time I don't even notice what forum it is in. It could be in 3rd party vendors, and I wouldn't care. Where it is important is the very large boards where the experts only watch certain forums. So, it is a waste of time to put a SQL Server question in an Exchange forum.

So, there you go. It is not about censorship at all. Censorship would be if I disagreed with your post, and I deleted it.

Jon,

I think that the user board is a gem. Many gems are multifaceted, as is the board. I would like to point out there are many users who never post on the board and we have no idea how many even read the posts. Certainly, there have been posts that have had a high number of visits and most of these pertain to hot ticket items that are being discussed such as electronic prescribing, meaningful use, etc. The posts can contain extremely valuable information that may be of help to multiple users. However, if a post becomes hijacked, either a serious user who is trying to work towards a solution or a casual user who has visited the board for this topic can get frustrated when the thread is hijacked, as one may end up wading through a bunch of nonrelevant material in trying to get to a relevant posts, especially if the hijack degenerates. The community at large does not post. The community at large does not hijack posts. The community at large probably does not want to define the rules. That is why we have a moderator. It is my opinion that if a user wants to philosophize, be witty, or post anything else that really does not pertain to the topic when we are dealing with a serious matter, it should be his or her responsibility to start a different thread and take those who wish to participate along. In doing so, the person who wishes to hijack a post may avoid censorship. This is akin to having personal responsibility. This also avoids having a person who started the thread becoming the policeman. We have already seen antagonism when Bert has tried to steer things back on course, as recently as the last several days. This is not helpful and gives a black eye to the board. Respect for other users should be one of the primary rules of this board.

I'm a little disappointed.

When I was skimming the topics,I thought this was more the ski-masks and AK47s hijacking. That is a subject area where I have some expertise. So, in my context the word has a very strong meaning.

Setting that aside, I have seen Bert "fork" a conversation so that the original topic remained, and the off/new topic got moved into it's own thread. More so if the Original Poster asked that the thread get moderated (privately or publicly).

Many is the time in the last year where someone reached out through PM or through our contact form, and they comment on my postings on the board - so I know there are far more reading than posting.

N.B. They are consistently gracious in their thoughts, so not sure if the comments stand out because of their "Unicorn" or "Gorilla throwing ****" qualities.

Forgive me Father, for I have sinned with my tangential thoughts.

I think that this board is helping people, and I see a large knowledgeable group of posters willing to donate their time. I would give it an A+. I think that this board is friendly and inclusive. I have not seen any disrespectful behavior. I would give it an A.

The lowest grade from me would be a C for board activity. I didn't find other ehrs with better boards, so this is probably the nature of busy physicians. My point is that if about a dozen people stopped posting, this board could die. I imagine others would fill in the gap, but this forum has very little activity compared to what I see on other boards. So my second point is that if we try to have everyone constantly on point, the board may be less healthy.

For most of my experience with forums, a supplicant like me will ask a question to get help. Hopefully an expert will respond and continue responding on point until the problem is solved. Other experts will not chime in unless they think something is being missed. The risk is that occasionally I may not get an answer if all experts are preoccupied with other rookies. Oh, and these forums have better search engines, so it is embarrassing to not do a thorough review of old threads before starting a new one. There is zero extraneous, relationship building conversation. Supplicants get specific help, and experts get ego strokes or marketing exposure. A thread is less than 10 posts and is buried and gone in hours.

I don't want to justify my sins, but to point out that there is benefit to having more lively conversations as long as the OP is helped. I think that everyone here wants to be helpful to the OP, even if we get distracted. I think that a thread to remind us of boundaries is a great idea.

Now, what is my penance?

Penance= read through the entire Affordable Care Act.











Sorry!

Gene

Ooookaaay, but I'm open to other suggestions too.

I count four, but you can't really count a post as a hijack when it is undecipherable, so that's three lol.

Dan's would be two, but since jimmie can't hijack his own thread his doesn't count nor do the two that he validated, so we are down to one.

That would be Gene's. But his is forgiven, because jimmie has basically shown that off topic comments aren't bothering him.
___________________
But, this all goes back to a few quick jokes probably aren't that big a deal.

Move to Big Sky Country where the incessant wind will take those thoughts and swirl them to who knows where.

Sorry Bert, I deleted my previous message thinking no one had seen it yet, so I changed this one up a bit but think it still has the same meaning.

I have not figured how to right click on the darn Chromebook to delete stuff, so I had to hold the delete button down forever to make this work.

As stated, you have carte blanche in your own thread.

I have to admit, I too am a sinner--I confess that I love the hijacks on the board. Jimmie's lateral thinking, the occasional rant, some great bits of humor such as Gene's above--these are what make me keep coming back to the Board. Yes, I find the opportunity to talk about AC/EHR/MU/etc helpful. But the Board is much more than a User Board. I think we have Bert and the other "old timers" to thank for that. And, besides, we all need to keep encouraging Bert to keep pushing on towards accomplishing his 10k!

Being lucky enough to have three out of four of my grandparents till my adulthood is a gift that transcends any ever or since.

What they gave me is the appreciation for the art of conversation. I think with all the immediacy of the technological gadgetry and internet, this ability to converse is becoming hampered and less esteemed than with the previous generation.

The conversations exhibited by the users on this board take me to an earlier time, and remind me that with the technological gadgetry and internet this art is alive and well. And takes me back to the time after a long day of quilting, and bumming a few cheetos my Grandmother was better than Twain at weaving her threads.

Yes, Jimmie, there really is a Luddite!

None of this would have happened if we still had Brian Cotner. Leslie, thanks for hanging around with your old buddies and keeping us on the almost straight and narrow.

Once Brian wrote a post aimed at me, which I kind of took wrong. I went into my turtle passive-aggressive mode and sulked. The phone rang. It was Brian, For those who never got to know him (he is still alive and doing what Leslie is doing), he was a pleasure to know.

Yes, and the last time I saw Brian he had on a carpal tunnel splint and was anticipating surgery!

@ Leslie the Luddite,
Are those calluses on the fingertips from quilting or "E-PICK"ing or both?

@Bert,
You are lucky I did not call, I would have bludgeoned you with Grant and Sherman facts, and polished you off with converting you to Updox, before I could even get to getting rid of the local server to "virtualize" with a Chromebook theme. You would likely have hung up and conference called Sandeep and JamesNT for a little sanity!!!!!!

NEOPHYTE LUDDITE LEARNING FROM THE BEST

@Jimmie....QUILTING????? You have got to be kidding? E-Picking? Well the callouses are more on my hands from pounding my forehead in disbelief.

Leslie,

It was a shameless stab in the dark to accuse you of quilt calluses.

Now what was this thread about??????

It was about hijacking, but since the post before yours was posted by the author of the thread, then you can fly the plane wherever you want.

jimmie,

Sorry. I hope I did not give you too much stress. I guess in a way it is a good thing do know. I would say that around 75%, maybe less, of users are notified by email of any post in their Watched List. So, if you are watching a thread such as this one, any post will result in an email sent to each user. The email contains a link to that post AND contains the post. So, once you hit submit, the post is distributed in its unedited form. If the user then clicks the link, if the post has been edited he or she will see the edited form.

If the post has been deleted, they will still see the original post as I did in the email, but clicking the link will bring them to a page with nothing on it but a broken link. While a user could always cut and paste and send a post anywhere they want, they can also email the post, email the post and all responses or email the entire thread to one or more people.

Sorry. I just thought you would like to know that. I did delete your post as I found it unfair for you to respond to something you didn't know about.

I DID COPY AND PASTE YOUR POST IF YOU WOULD LIKE IT REPOSTED.

Bert,

It is your call if you want to post it. If you think it will help, I defer to you.

From here on out I will not be sending a post and then correcting it hoping no one has read it yet. Thank you for letting me know about this.

I don't think it will help much. As you said, there is no real good post to reference it to.

I'll probably sit by the fire and read it over and over.

I guess if others clamor for it, you can post it, that would be fine as well. Have a Merry Christmas!!!!!

Nothing like hijacking a hijacking thread with a Have a Merry Christmas!!!!! so Have a Merry Christmas!!!!!

Merry Christmas to you as well.

Between all the things that have been entered and deleted and all the obscure comments, I am completely lost.
If this whole thing was an attempt to convince me that hijacking can be a problem, then I suppose I am convinced.

Clamor! Clamor!! Clamor!!!

Merry Christmas to all who celebrate Jesus' birth, and Happy Holidays to all who do not.

Gene