Home Forums Discussions Problems By Users For Users

This was the "subtitle" of this board, until recently (At the top of the page was "Amazing Charts User Board; By Users For Users"). Is that no longer the case?

This board is unusual, insofar as it seems more or less sanctioned by the company, which is different from other product associated boards I have joined. I have, in fact, never been entirely clear on the relationship between the user's group and AC itself. If it is "their" board... in whatever sense... then I would like that to be more clear. However, in that case, I also expect the company to really BE involved, monitor for problems and respond. They are doing a lot better recently, but I think there was not a lot of involvement for several months after version 6 was released, and a lot of issues were being aired here. We are here to help each other, but if it is really an offshoot of Amazing Charts, Inc., we should not have to operate in a vacuum. For my part, in that situation I feel an obligation to operate under significant restraint in not wantonly badmouthing AC on their own board or applauding the good parts of competing products.

However, if this board is really independent, then they have no obligation to respond to our issues, I am free to share any opinion I have (stopping short of libel), and I believe it may be inappropriate to have AC staff in a position to edit or otherwise censor my posts. I just want to know how it is.

I think the board is an entity of AC. In a nutshell, I think before v6, the board was mostly positive, and most negative or critical comments not really being negative but suggesting other features.

There were certain areas of AC that got picked on more than others, e.g. the letter writer, imported items, etc. But, for the most part, anyone reading the board were more likely to purchase AC.

After v6, as you said, there were more and more negative comments due to huge issues with v6. The irony is that it was only TWO issues. And, I think what fueled the fire was a lack of communication.

So, the pendulum swung from left to right and now back toward the middle.

Personally, I prefer it to be the board it was without a lot of AC intervention including tech support. It would be helpful for them to read the board to get the pulse of what is going on, but why come on the board and read about the prescription writer, when I am sure many, many users sent that bug into AC.

I liked the "By Users For Users" to make it clear to anyone reading the board that we are not AC employees but actual users, and that this is not the place to report official feedback to AC.

I also agree that AC should periodically read the board to get a sense of problems that are being discussed.

It was also extremely helpful to have the "rapid response team" (JB) write a post when the electronic prescribing hit a snag last week in order to let everyone know quickly.

And, I think that AC should have the ability to remove clearly inappropriate or mean spirited posts.

Bert,
You bring up an interesting point regarding Amazing Charts staff posting on the board. I'm no expert, but have served as an assistant sysop on another board for near 10 years. I saw a lot of confrontation!

I think the bottom line is that the users need Amazing Charts staff, and the Amazing Charts staff need the users. We may disagree at times, but I think it is helpful to have AC staff posting on the board. Most companies now have a "social media" expert on staff to handle these things.

Newbies to the board would probably be turned off if they didn't see A/C staff postings as they would judge this as a lack of caring by the company.

My practice management software company started a user board but it was taken down as anything that was said detrimental about the company was taken down. We want to be honest in our criticism, but IMHO users shouldn't go off the deep end in criticism. ( Bert this isn't directed at you , just making a general statement)

That is my 2 cents.

Ich habe keine Stimme.

Leslie,
Please speak English. I have a cold and am in brain fog. Dumb it down for me please?

? Ich habe keine Stimme. - I have no voice.

OK, I'm cool with this being AC's board. Likewise with their option to edit. But, as Spidey would say, "with great power comes great responsibility."

I think that tech support can be most useful in a somewhat broad way. Maybe noting a bunch of TSP800 issues and saying something like "We are investigating; we are pretty sure it is an issue with one particular Win 7 driver. It does seem to work with this other particular driver and these settings, so maybe try that." One post could save them 60 calls. On the other hand, I don't think they need be involved with "How do y'all use UpDox for importing labs for MU credit?"

If you use Backup Assist, which Leslie does, they have several ways to get support. One is my favorite, which is to post my question online. It is a regular user board, but I have never seen a user talk to another user. It is basically a support board.

I can't really tell you why, maybe I am just a vain person. I just prefer only users on the board, which, of course, flies right in the face of what AC is doing which is an attempt to be more involved. (which is a good thing for 99% of the users).

We need AC support for sure in a support way, and we need each other to have posts like these.

Maybe going without an avatar or a flower or something would camouflage me.

I liked the old board.

Thanks Jon. Sorry you don't feel well Ken. Over the years I had much to say about AC some bad,mostly good. But of late, I really feel my voice has been heard, yet not understood. So I will just stand on the risers and pretend I know words to the chorus. )

But, don't you feel we do a lot of flailing around in the dark without significant tech support input? What if they were to say regarding the TSP800 "Try this; it seems to work on our test machines." And 30 people try it, and 12 of them say "Nope; didn't work." Then they, and we, could start to narrow it down. Without them, there are so many variables it is really, really tough, no matter how bright some of you are.

Users solve a lot of common problems and are available when tech support is not.

I for one would like more AC tech involvement. They need to keep a handle on the pulse of the users and this is one way. But only checking the board every blue moon as they have done in the past is not going to help them be aware.

I do think that AC is a very open company and makes this an open forum to discuss things.

I do see that sometimes it can sway both positive and negative but most are mature enough to understand that. Those who did not buy the product due to a few negative comments probably have not done enough due dilagence and probably will make unhappy customers regardless of what they choose. Better to leave them behind.

What do you mean by the old board?

Wow. The day they do that is definitely the day I am off the board. I guess it depends on how mean spirited it is. You live by the sword and you die by the sword.

This forum has sold more EMRs than you can imagine. Back in the day prior to a certain version, this board was 95% positive. But, you have to have a control just as in a study.

It was the negative comments and the constant complaining about v6 that got it fixed.

David, we did flail around in the dark. We did try i7s and increased RAM and hardware acceleration, etc.

What you are describing is beta testing. Actual beta testing. 200 people saying yes it works and 50 saying no. But, this isn't tech support -- it is development.

For me, sure some tech support on the board or watching the board who see obvious and easy answers sure. But, it is the developers who can watch the board. And, if they are watching the board to see how TSP is doing, then the only way they will find out it is not working is "negative comments."

Well, OK, Bert... I accept your semantical correction. But a lot of what we have here is not following the usual paradigm, and I have some sympathy for AC on this. You had a product that was forced into a somewhat premature release by a large body of clients who were desperate for MU money. First it came out as a real, honest "take your chances" beta, then got the production label put on it so as to not lose a competitive advantage. When significant bugs were found, all of a sudden there were hundreds of de facto beta testers, many on this board. At that point, I think AC would have done better by realizing it as a resource, and doing as I proposed. Maybe they could have offered a bit of a break on the guardian angel fee for those inadvertent "assistant developers". But, I bet the problems could and would have been solved quicker.

Now, maybe we are again entering a new period of stability, like the "old board," and it will once again all be about helping new users and fine tuning our practices and systems. But, version 7 is out there. And some are clambering for its release. And I'll bet pounds to pickles that we are going to face the same sorts of issues again.

So again, if this board is a part of AC, and staff are involved in its activities, then I would vote they do so with full and open involvement. I am sure Travis and our other surgeon compadres would agree that you don't go into an operation planning to do it half-heartedly.

To my mind, the ?ideal board? would be run ?by and for users?, as this one has been, but with significant input from the company. In other words, we have complete freedom to (responsibly) say what we want, and AC provides input and answers to questions, and gains positive PR, a source of free user support, and an additional public forum for disseminating information to users. Such a board has significant benefits to both the users and the company. I was pleased that in recent weeks we were functioning in exactly that way.
Apparently some of what appeared here was unacceptable and so the company wants to limit, to an unclear degree, what can be said. I say ?apparently? because, somewhat ironically, there has been no statement from Jon B or Trish, our new admin*, as to exactly what changes are planned. I assume that will be forthcoming. Perhaps this change is simply an administrative one; but when you remove the slogan ?by and for users?, and name an administrator who works for AC (rather than a user), it seems that a more fundamental change is afoot.
The assumption made by Dave and others above is that this change implies increased input by tech support and others at the company to add more ?official? answers to user issues. Hopefully that is true and is the trade-off in return for some limitation of our own freedom of expression.

*It was suggested that I edit this post to reflect the fact that Trish is actually a global moderator, not an administrator. That is true, but in reality the name of the title is less important than the associated privileges.

Trish is actually a global moderator and not an admin, but, I too, do not understand the reasoning. You do not have to be a moderator to follow the board and provide tech support.

Funny...it was the colors I think I liked better before. This is a little too shiney.

Hey, Leslie... c'mon back and get your nose bloody with the rest of us! Otherwise I won't have anyone to taunt about the evils of templates!!

Dear___David_______,

I have reviewed your post dated __11/15/11________ and regret to inform you that __epistaxis continuosum_____________ is not on my list of approved Board duties. I therefore must refer you to __Bert__ for any further comments or questions. I will however continue to take all of your future _posts and ragging________under consideration.

Thank you for your kind__________consideration,


_Jokingly,__________________

Leslie
[i][/i]

David,

This is nothing against AC, but all that anyone was asking for was for Amazing Charts to come on the board and explain things. To let us know they were working on the prescription writer.

When it comes to issues of free speech, it always depends on who is doing the judging. I bet we would all agree that a profanity laced diatribe against another board poster should be removed. Would you leave the board if AC removed such a post? That may be clear cut, but other posts may be matters of opinion. Since the board is provided by AC, I do think they have a right to use their judgement about what they consider to be harmful to users or the company. It could be a real liability to the company if they did not have the ability to remove inappropriate posts. I think AC has allowed honest, open discourse and feedback, both good and bad, on this board.

There is a phrase that says, "That goes without saying."

Please no offense Donna (I mean seriously please), but you joined the board in 2/2011.

The board was so different in the past. There didn't need to be all this. Everyone was civil, and the board sold EMRs.

I think we should all agree to disagree - I have never seen any real censoring, although even in the past I think there has been threads that have been deleted when there was problems. I don't think those were deleted by AC but by a moderator....

Bert,
Certainly no offense taken. I think these are interesting discussions and viewpoints about the role of AC and users. I was reading the board long before I bought AC, or joined the board. I started looking at AC 5 years ago, but just was not ready for all the work entailed to effect the conversion. The information on the board was very helpful to me in selecting AC, and learning to use it. I have seen in my time reading it the change in tone from one that was nearly wholly positive to very negative in the last 5 months since Version 6 was released. I think users and AC alike recognize that the program's performance went off track. And, I hope that we all have a role in improving the software that is vital to our work every day. This board has a sense of collegiality that I think is lacking in much of our medical world.

Hey, Leslie...

I'll show you mine if you show me yours...

@Donna,

I agree.

David,

That is classic!

David, that's great!

JBS, Maybe we need duty designations like David's for our local group!

Leslie, I love your new avatar. That's a big change from demonic dog to angelic.

And, Mighty Mouse is back! All is right with the world!

I notice by users for users is back......

@Donna. It is weird because I changed my avatar and apparently everyone can see it but me. I still see the demonic dog!

I spoke too soon. Mighty Mouse is gone again! Underdog doesn't show up nearly as well.

Steven, I like your avatar too; is that a specific character?

I was just a doctor character that a graphics company found online and appropriated - I have had it on coffee mugs, hats, shirts, coats, backpacks etc - I currently use it as my color logo and a small local company will custom embroider anything - even 1 at a time without any real added cost (50 set up fee - he waived it for me as I have ordered lots of things in the past).

It is nice to be able to just make 4 shirts - can get them for staff - looks good for events, looks professional and really costs little. I had a company that made coffee mugs for me years ago - bought 144 for a little over 200 dollars. Have done twice and still see them in homes and at some restaurants, etc in small town.

Either these things are changing spontaneously or there is a lot of hallucinogen use by AC docs on the board here. To my eye, Leslie's dog is still the demon, not the angel. Bert is MM again. Pooh is Pooh (she said "just call me Pooh"). Sounds like others are seeing them differently.

Steven, I am glad that you like my copyrighted doctor pic that I left in the South Bend Starbucks a few years ago. I will be happy to negotiate the intellectual property rights to that picture; sounds like you already owe me a pretty penny, what with all of the shirts, mugs, and online use.